Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...

Author Topic: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...  (Read 14085 times)

Offline Mopar_Mudder

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2010 - 05:01:25 PM »
Great article about the 2-3 shifts being hard.  Yes their has been people that have had trouble in the past.  Here is what I tell most people, especially 4 speed users about missing shifts right off the start.  It's amazing the folks that do and I have even done it.  The shifting pattern is different on the TKO versus a 4 speed.  The 1-2 shift is straight back on the 4 speed.  The 1-2 on a 5 speed is actually slightly angled to the right, 2-3 is straight forward.  The 4 speed shift for 2-3 is straight angle away and to the top. See the difference. 

I suspect the the forks are the issue here and I've put a phone call into Liberty to see exactly what they do.  I'll let you know what they say.  I'll try and get the exploded view of the TKO and highlight the parts that I are they are talking about. 

Tony

Look forward to hearing what you find. I know I have heard similar things about the Viper 6 speed tranny, I have one in my SRT-10 truck. Alot of people have had trouble with the 2-3 and putting in a different shifter solved it, personaly I never had an issue.
1971 Hemi Cuda

2005 SRT-10 Regular Cab Flame Red.   12.771 @ 109.67 <-----Time Slip --Video
Mopar: Headers, Exhaust, Ram Air, ECM

2008 3500 Mega Cab Dually, Resistal Edition




Offline Mopar_Mudder

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2010 - 12:25:55 PM »
 

I suspect the the forks are the issue here and I've put a phone call into Liberty to see exactly what they do.  I'll let you know what they say.  I'll try and get the exploded view of the TKO and highlight the parts that I are they are talking about. 

Tony


Any new info on this? I would really like to get a deal hammered out this week or next.

Don't know if it means anything to you but they have a little bit of info on their "upgraded" version on there web site: http://www.libertysgears.com/ttc.htm
1971 Hemi Cuda

2005 SRT-10 Regular Cab Flame Red.   12.771 @ 109.67 <-----Time Slip --Video
Mopar: Headers, Exhaust, Ram Air, ECM

2008 3500 Mega Cab Dually, Resistal Edition

Offline Tom Quad

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2010 - 07:14:06 AM »
Yep! And here is how it was done.  The engine and transmission create a three point mounting scheme.  In converting these cars as prototypes for the kits -  A brace was installed under the car, fastened to the chassis and used to position the engine in the location that it previously was in with the 4 speed.  The brace was removed, transmission lowered and removed and the brace re-installed to position the motor in the correct position.  New bell housing was installed which is an exact replica of the mine - it was my unit the mold for the casting was made from.  Brace again removed, engine lowered, Tremec installed, brace re-installed.  Next was the isolation mount and then careful measurements for the cross member.  As far as driveline angles - 3.12 degree's down using a machinist scale.  The Tremec is a taller and longer transmission - correct.  The geometric position of the end of the tail housing does NOT end up in the same spot as the 833 4 speed.

I have pictures - lots of pictures - Would you like me to e-mail them to you and is there anything special you are wanting to see?

No I do not want anything else from you other than the truth. I don't need to see pics i have plenty from my own former nightmare.  I give you kudos for admitting that the trans is TALL but you side step the issues having the tailshaft in an "unusual" position and the 2-3 shift problem that is common and unacceptable.

Even if this variant was free i would not install it in any ones car as it is a compromise. My work is my signature and "good enough"  is not in my vocabulary.  Mediocrity is not acceptable when excellence is required.

Offline bigblue73

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2010 - 09:24:50 AM »
Tom I think I need to put in graphical terms for you.  The angles are the similar, held at that position for that reason, but when you have a longer shaft the location of the u-joint or end of the tail shaft will be in a different location since the transmission is longer.  Does that make sense to you.

This statement is correct - There is no possible way to make the Tremec TKO and the 833 to come out at the same location since there are dimensional differences in the overall lengths. 

Offline Mopar_Mudder

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2010 - 10:17:14 AM »
The only thing that really maters is that the tranmission and rear axle are at the same angle. The tail shaft and rear end yoke need to run exacly parallel to each other, simple as that. I think you are making too much of this.
1971 Hemi Cuda

2005 SRT-10 Regular Cab Flame Red.   12.771 @ 109.67 <-----Time Slip --Video
Mopar: Headers, Exhaust, Ram Air, ECM

2008 3500 Mega Cab Dually, Resistal Edition

Offline bigblue73

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2010 - 12:53:48 PM »
I want folks to become educated and ask the questions and yes the challenges are interesting and inturn are to be expected.  Hell if I could I'd like to do a video on the R&D effort in the make up of these kits.  It's not rocket science by any means, it's all about good sound mechanical components sourced to work together.  I'm lucky to work for employer that has equipment to design and then precision cut a part(s) that will be representative of the production units.

Offline Mopar_Mudder

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2010 - 01:14:15 PM »
See if this helps. It really doesn't mater how far foward/back or up/down the tail shaft is as long as it is the same angle as the rear end.

1971 Hemi Cuda

2005 SRT-10 Regular Cab Flame Red.   12.771 @ 109.67 <-----Time Slip --Video
Mopar: Headers, Exhaust, Ram Air, ECM

2008 3500 Mega Cab Dually, Resistal Edition

Offline Jim

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Re: Hurst Drivelines TKO 5 Speed converison kit ...
« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2010 - 01:35:28 PM »
The only thing that really maters is that the tranmission and rear axle are at the same angle. The tail shaft and rear end yoke need to run exacly parallel to each other, simple as that. I think you are making too much of this.

That’s only true if you never hammer the car or don’t mind axle hop.

Ideally, the pinion needs to be angled down a bit from the drive shaft angle 1.5-3 degrees, while maintaining parallelism to the output shaft. Under heavy acceleration, your pinion rotates up. If it goes beyond parallel with the driveshaft, axle hop ensues. The more horsepower and traction, the bigger the problem.

If you raise your pinion to accommodate the lower output shaft on the transmission to keep things parallel, you end up with this problem. You either end up with the wrong pinion axle and axle hop, or a driveshaft phasing harmonic vibration.

I fought this issue in my Charger w/TKO600, swapping a lot of shims to find a good compromise.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2010 - 01:37:47 PM by 471_Magnum »
-Jim
"Relax, all right? My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools. I can fix it. "