Author Topic: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start  (Read 8004 times)

Offline 1mopar1

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Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« on: February 11, 2011 - 12:23:55 AM »
73 challenger with a 383 stock electronic ignition distrubutor, 5 pin box, voltage regulator, 4 pin resistor, msd blaster 2 coil. We cannot figure this out. When all wiring is hooked up and you try and start the car, nothing, no ticking or anything. When you take the wire off the distributor side of  the coil car will crank. When i originally got this car they had a wire from the positive battery post and an alligator clip you would clip on the same side of the coil as mentioned above. What gives. Is it because of the 12 volt coil. would changing to a 6 volt coil fix the problem. Thanks for any help.




Offline 72bluNblu

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2011 - 02:12:56 AM »
No! Do not switch to a 6v coil!  :nono:

First of all, the type of coil and how its hooked up shouldn't have anything to do with whether or not the car cranks.

Secondly, 12v coils can be of two varieties, internally ballasted or externally ballasted. Stock mopar coils have an external ballast resistor, (that 4 pin resistor), so the voltage is stepped down, usually to around 8 or 9 volts, before it gets to the coil. This is NOT the same as a 6v coil!!! Coils can also have an internal ballast, so you can hook 12v directly to them. The coil still only uses 8-9 volts, but you don't have to look at an external ballast on your firewall because the ballast is inside the coil.

Now, if you have an internal ballast coil, and hook an external ballast to it, you won't see much voltage in your ignition system since you'll be stepping the voltage down twice. Check to make sure your MSD blaster 2 is an external ballast type coil. If it's not, you'll need to find a 12v source for it instead of running it off of the 4 pin ballast resistor.

Now, even if you did manage to hook an external ballast to an internally ballasted coil, I'd think the car would still run. It would definitely still crank! So, the other thing to look for would be an owner installed kill switch, or the remnants of one. It's not unheard of to put a kill switch into the coil power source, or into the distributor power. If someone did that, its possible that with that wire hooked up is grounding out your ignition system. It might be through a switch, or, the switch may have been removed at some point and you'll have to chase down what's left of the kill switch wiring. Check to make sure that the coil power source runs back directly to the ballast, and the distributor power (off the coil) goes directly from the coil to the distributor. If they split or take any detours, you may have your problem.

Other than that, if unhooking your distributor is the only way to get the car to crank, I'd have to say your distributor must be drawing a whole ton of amps.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2011 - 02:30:48 AM by 72bluNblu »

Offline 1mopar1

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2011 - 10:24:15 AM »
Will do some wire searching and see if I can find anything. We completly removed all of the wiring to paint the car and followed the wiring schematic for reinstall. Didnt see any extra wires but wasnt looking. Will see what we can find. Thanks for the advise.

Offline dodj

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2011 - 03:17:18 PM »
No! Do not switch to a 6v coil!  :nono:

First of all, the type of coil and how its hooked up shouldn't have anything to do with whether or not the car cranks.

Repeat-  do not use 6V coil!

But one job at a time - solve your cranking issue first - ignore the ignition until you get it to turn over properly.

Then turn your attention to the ignition system.
Scott
1973 Challenger  440 4 spd 
2007.5 3500 6.7 Cummins Diesel, Anarchy tuned.
Good friends don't let friends do stupid things. ........alone.

Offline 72rtchallenger

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2011 - 06:52:29 PM »
i know a bad neutral switch will cause the car not to crank but i dont know that unhooking the coil wire on the distributor side will let it crank if the neutral switch is bad,,but you could try jumping out the neutral switch an see if you can get the car to crank if you dont find a wire grounding out the system
« Last Edit: February 11, 2011 - 06:56:41 PM by 72rtchallenger »
72rtchallenger
my challengers restro at http://www.cardomain.com/ride/399010
what happens in the garage
stays in the garage

Offline dodj

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2011 - 09:15:01 PM »
 :popcorn:
Scott
1973 Challenger  440 4 spd 
2007.5 3500 6.7 Cummins Diesel, Anarchy tuned.
Good friends don't let friends do stupid things. ........alone.

Offline 72rtchallenger

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2011 - 10:08:00 PM »
 :popcorn:  :drunk:  :popcorn:
72rtchallenger
my challengers restro at http://www.cardomain.com/ride/399010
what happens in the garage
stays in the garage

Offline Jesus H Chrysler

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2011 - 09:49:17 PM »
Is your coil connected with proper polarity?  When rewiring from scratch it's easy to put the wrong wire on the wrong post.  If removing just one wire is the difference between crank and no crank it seems something is grounding out.  I don't have a diagram in front of me but I don't believe the starter relay and coil connect in a manner where the relay would get shorted by the coil, but I may be wrong.

I've used the battery to coil wire trick to get cars running with unknown ignition problems.  This should be used only as a temporary solution because of the previously mentioned overdriving of the coil.  I would remove all non factory wiring and start from there.  My car had a butchered engine harness that had mystery wires everywhere so I can sympathize.  Sometimes it's best to start over.
Yes I own a 1972 Dodge Challenger Convertible T/A S/E with a 440 Six Pak. Can it get any more wrong?

{OO /===\ OO}
(OO==> <==OO)



Greg, in the middle of MA has:
1970 Dodge Coronet 440 "Zom Bee"
1972 Dodge Challenger convertible 440 5 speed.
1973 Dodge Challenger 318 "Brown Bomber"
2012 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic Blackberry Pearl.
2001 Jeep Wrangler locked, lifted and lighted.  "Jeep is a registered trademark of Chrysler Corporation"

Offline Challenger III

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2011 - 11:42:19 PM »
Have you tested your voltage with a meter? Measure from coil positive to ground with key on and everything hooked up normally. It sounds to me like something is shorted or grounded in the ignition system.
Mike    Yakima, Washington

Resto Thread:  http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=66668.0

Offline Cooter

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2011 - 05:43:28 AM »
Sounds like somebody followed the Mopar Perf. electronic ignition diagram when they hooked up the starter solenoid wire indirectly to the coil..I did this from the diagram and mine would start, but would keep the starter ingaged. Need to double check all the witing to and from the ignition box..
1958 plymouth Belvedere 2dr hd top "Christine" [OO)====V====(OO]
1969 dodge Charger "General Lee"         [___|______I______|___]                        
1968 Dodge Dart 2dr sedan 505" Stroker    (O]=0==========0=[O)                
1970 Challenger R/T Clone "Kowalski Special"   (OO) [___________] (OO)

Offline 73EStroker

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2011 - 02:10:39 PM »
You have a wiring problem amigo! Start with a schematic available off the Moparts.com then go through one wire at a time. What I do is highlight the affected wires, then trace them out and colour them in with another colour once you have verified correct wires and connections are solid electrically speaking. Before you do all of this disconnect your control wires to the starter solenoid and to the distributor. You will want to get a helper and verify connections with a voltmeter on one side of a connection (such as firewall etc) then re-verify on the other. Voltage should be the same. Helper will operate the key, move the gear lever (if you are auto) or push the clutch pedal. That's why you don't want it to start until all of this work is verified.
Wiring is the worst job but once it is verified you can rest assured it will start at that car show where everyone is watching.
Barry (Salmon Arm)

Offline jimynick

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2011 - 11:23:13 PM »
A huge proportion of wiring misery is due to bad grounds. A classic one is nicely painting the engine and having ignition grief because the distributor can't find ground due to the paint and nice new fibre gasket that was installed between it and the block. Power WILL find it's way to it's electrical home and giving it some good grounds to do so will only help in the fight. Good luck  :banghead:

Offline 1mopar1

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2011 - 09:25:27 PM »
think I fixed it. I had a burn red wire where it connected under the dask. The big plastice connector was taken apart and I found blackish burnt metal over one connector. I spliced a wire on both sides of the connector together and all appears well. Thank you all for you ideas. I tried them all. Doug

Offline dodj

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2011 - 01:31:34 PM »
The steering column connector?
Scott
1973 Challenger  440 4 spd 
2007.5 3500 6.7 Cummins Diesel, Anarchy tuned.
Good friends don't let friends do stupid things. ........alone.

Offline 1mopar1

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Re: Confused about getting my 73 challenger to start
« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2011 - 11:59:41 PM »
yes dodj