Ignition issue, engine will not start.

[-009-]

Looking for a few ideas that may cause my engine not to start.
It did start and then died within five seconds, on two occasions.
The car was running before the engine was pulled for a rebuild, so
I'm wondering if it could be a wiring fault rather than a component.


- Engine is a fresh 340 build set to 12 BTC (maybe 180 off, piston
  visually seen at TDC)
- It has a total of two sparks one when you initially crank the engine
  and one when you stop cranking it over. (pulled coil wire from the
  distributor check spark)
- At the plugs I'd get one initial spark and that is it.
- Resistor: 12VDV one side and 7VDC on the other, with the ignition on
- Coil: 7VDC on the + side and 1VDC on the - side, with the ignition on.
- Car has a Chrysler Electronic ignition.
- The neutral safety switch was bypassed, though that's not ignition related
  from what I can see.
- Reluctor/pickup gap and it is set to .006.

Things done:
- Verified body ground is good
- Removed the tachometer wire from the coil
- Continuity checks
  - alternator to ballast = good
  - Ballast to + side of coil = good
  - Checked the bulkhead connections = good

Potential issues I'm leaning towards:
- Coil
- ECM
- Ground issue

Thank you for any ideas.

[1 Wild R/T]

You don't say what type ignition but it sounds like a Chrysler Electronic....   Check the air gap between the reluctor & the pickup coil.... It should be .006-.010 stay toward the .006 ................

[-009-]

You don't say what type ignition but it sounds like a Chrysler Electronic....   Check the air gap between the reluctor & the pickup coil.... It should be .006-.010 stay toward the .006 ................

Just checked the reluctor/pickup gap and it is set to .006.
You are correct the car has a Chrysler Electronic ignition.

Also I forgot to mention the car was running before the engine was pulled for the rebuild.

Edited original post with those details.

[70chall440]

So I (we) have this straight;

your car was running, you pulled the engine and rebuilt it. You reinstalled the rebuilt engine, you set the engine at TDC and have aligned the distributor with the rotor at or near the #1 distributor terminal.

The engine fired, then died in 5 seconds twice (on 2 occasions).

Is all this correct?

Before we start chasing monsters, you should do some basic diagnosis; as I am sure you know the engine needs 3 things to run; air, fuel, fire and compression.

- You should have compression with a fresh rebuild
- so long as the nothing plugging the carb/intake you should have air

So, that leaves us with fuel and fire (spark)

I assume you have checked to see if there is fuel squirting in from the carb or have poured some in.

Have you determined if you have spark? Pull a plug or use another one, pull off a spark plug wire and plug it onto the spark plug you pulled or acquired, hold it to a ground (exhaust manifold, bolt on the engine, etc. NOT THE BATTERY). have someone turn the car over and watch the spark plug to see if there is any spark.

If there is, look to see how strong it is (bright spark verses dim spark), also check to see if it sparking consistently (it should be rhythmic meaning it should spark in time with the engine turning over).

If you have strong spark and it is consistent, then you probably have either too much fuel (flooded) or not enough. I have seen this on rebuilt motors a few time, everything is clean and there is lubricants in the cylinders so it takes more fuel and some time to get it to explode.

you can try and squirt a little ether (quick start, starting fluid, etc.) but do not hose it down, you jut want to see if it will fire.

[-009-]

So I (we) have this straight;

your car was running, you pulled the engine and rebuilt it. You reinstalled the rebuilt engine, you set the engine at TDC and have aligned the distributor with the rotor at or near the #1 distributor terminal.

The engine fired, then died in 5 seconds twice (on 2 occasions).

Is all this correct?

Before we start chasing monsters, you should do some basic diagnosis; as I am sure you know the engine needs 3 things to run; air, fuel, fire and compression.

- You should have compression with a fresh rebuild
- so long as the nothing plugging the carb/intake you should have air

So, that leaves us with fuel and fire (spark)

I assume you have checked to see if there is fuel squirting in from the carb or have poured some in.

Have you determined if you have spark? Pull a plug or use another one, pull off a spark plug wire and plug it onto the spark plug you pulled or acquired, hold it to a ground (exhaust manifold, bolt on the engine, etc. NOT THE BATTERY). have someone turn the car over and watch the spark plug to see if there is any spark.

If there is, look to see how strong it is (bright spark verses dim spark), also check to see if it sparking consistently (it should be rhythmic meaning it should spark in time with the engine turning over).

If you have strong spark and it is consistent, then you probably have either too much fuel (flooded) or not enough. I have seen this on rebuilt motors a few time, everything is clean and there is lubricants in the cylinders so it takes more fuel and some time to get it to explode.

you can try and squirt a little ether (quick start, starting fluid, etc.) but do not hose it down, you jut want to see if it will fire.

- The car was running fine before being removed.
- The rotor is facing the #1 cylinder, with the piston at the top of the cylinder and the timing mark set to 12 BTC.
  - What do you mean by at or near the #1 distributor terminal? The rotor is facing the #1 Cylinder and the tower closest to it is connected to the #1 plug. Also if it was 180 off the piston would be all the way down right? 
- That is correct the engine started momentarily on two occasions out of many attempts to start it.
- The carb was visually checked and is spraying fuel
- The single spark I got from the plug was a yellow/orange color. There is no consistent spark. The most sparks I was able to get was from pulling the wire from the cap and cranking the engine, where it would spark twice on initial cranking and when you stopped.

[70chall440]

Ok, we are making progress.

I am pretty sure you are not 180 off.

Here is what I have always done and continue to do;

- Rotate the dampner to 0, or exactly TDC (visually check if possible).
- adjust the distributor so that the contact on the rotor is under the #1 spark plug terminal
- make sure the cap is wired correctly (plug wires going to the correct spark plug)

All that said, it sounds like you have an ignition problem; you need to look very hard at your ignition system, at a minimum you need to check the coil connections and the ignition control module. Make sure everything is connected correctly and securely. Weak spark would indicate the coil, however sporadic spark could be either.

remove the plug on the module and inspect it, reinstall it and tighten down the center bolt (not too tight, it doesnt require a lot).

look at all of the wires on the coil to include the coil to distributor lead. Make sure they are tight and/or seated. Also while you are at it, trace the coil wires as much as you can and make sure they are connected (one side runs to the ballast resistor)

Check the ballast resistor, replace it just to be sure.

Since it started a couple of times, I think it is basically right, IMO its either a bad or disconnected wire, bad ballast resistor, or bad coil.

[jhaag]

My guess is that you are only getting power to the coil while the engine is cranking. Once you release the key you no longer have power to the coil. Check your wiring...

[70chall440]

That could very well be that as well. Check the wiring going to/coming from the ballast resistor.

[-009-]

The problem has been fixed! Thank you guys for the help and leading me in the right direction. In the end, it was a bad connection between the ignition switch harness and dash harness on the I-1 brown wire.

A quick run down of what I did to find the problem so others might be able to solve a similar issue.

- Tested the distributor/coil I bypassed the control module and put a jumper wire from the + battery terminal to the + side of the coil. (engine started)
- Then applied removed the input/power wire from the resistor and put the jumper in its place. (engine started)
- From there I did a few continuity and power test to the ECU using this site http://www.fourforty.com/techstuff/ignition.html (ECU tested good)
- Then pulled wiring harnesses and cleaned all grounds/terminals, in the engine bay. (did not start)

At this point the engine bay wiring was good. The problem was the coil would get voltage before and after cranking the engine over. This led me to me running continuity checks on I-1 the brown wire. This was my problem, in the end, the connection between the plug was fine. The issue was the pin moved back and lost continuity causing the starting issue.

[70chall440]

Outstanding, great work.