Author Topic: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)  (Read 3764 times)

Offline TRIPLE-GREEN

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 605
    • Coupe Custom Accessories
Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« on: September 03, 2009 - 12:43:26 PM »
I really have two questions.
 
Q1. I was going to rebuild the front end on my 73 challenger. It pulls to one side and some of the bushings are getting a little cracked and old. Would like to improve handling most of all. I am not a racer but this is a driver and I would like something that holds up best and can handle its own at higher speeds.
   My questions is simple really. Has anyone done the Polygraphite conversion to there challenger? I have a small block in mine and I am looking for improvement. Would like feedback. (Looking at super Polygraphite kit from PST)

Q2. I was thinking of replacing my torsion bars. My car sits a little low in front with little travel between the arms and bumpers. I was worried they might be old and slumpy. Can I get info on torsion bars. How do I know if mine should be replaced.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2009 - 12:48:30 PM by TRIPLE-GREEN »




Offline burdar

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5925
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2009 - 01:13:17 PM »
I'm installing the poly bushings right now.  It will be awhile before the car is on the road though.  The poly bushings will give you a harder ride since they don't flex like the OE bushings but handling should be better.  Just make sure you have good tires and shocks to take advantage of the new bushings.

I did however install an OE LCA bushing instead of a poly one.  The OE LCA bushings are recomended by a lot of people but require more work to install.  The outer bushing sleeve needs to be removed from the LCA to install the new OE bushing.  The poly LCA bushing re-uses the factory outer bushing sleeve.

Torsion bars can be cranked up if the car is sitting too low.  I would try that first before replacing the bars.  Is your car a Rallye.  They came with bigger bars than the standard Challengers.  If you have a standard Challenger, you could upgrade to the Rallye bars for better handling.   The bars have to come out anyway when you are re-doing the suspension.

Offline TRIPLE-GREEN

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 605
    • Coupe Custom Accessories
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2009 - 02:00:47 PM »
GREAT INFO!!
Thanks for the help.
What is the stock ride height of the front? Anyone know? Would like to see how far mine is slumped. It sits level but has a bad squeek on the right side and doesn't seem to have much travel between the arm and the bumper. What is stock height?

Offline HP2

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 4478
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2009 - 02:30:24 PM »
I use PST oly in all my builds, but I prefer the firmness improvement over stock. I have seen complaints that they cause rattles through the rest of the car because of their ability to trasmit force. I've also heard of squeaking issues, but I've never had those with PST poly. So, IMO, rubber vs poly is a personal choice of quiet and comfort over firmness and deflection. For a street car, either will work out fine.

Stepping up the t-bars is also a nice step up in improving the cars road feel, responsiveness, and performance. Again, somewhat of a personl choice of how firm, but a .96 in a small block car with all steel panels and/or air condition would be a very nice street set up. Combined with the 6 leaf XHD rear springs, off the shelf gas charged shocks, and a modern alignmnet and suddenly your car will feel almost modern in its road manners. The slightly bigger torsion bars wll also help with front end bottoming situations that 35+ year old t-bars may have. Burder is right, you can turn them up a bit if your ride height is too low, but that will not improve their ability to resist slamming in to the bump stops.

Speaking of which, the factory ride height is measured this way; from the floor to the bottom of the lower ball joint is measurement#1. From the floor to the bottom of the t-bar socket is measurement #2. Measurement #2 should be .75 higher than measurement #1. If you adjust the car to this height, I'm almost willing to bet it will be nose high and you won't like the look. Once everything is back together, set it where you like it and tell the alignment tech to leave the ride height where it is.

While your in for alignmnet, do not use the factory specs unless your using reproduction original tires. Those specs are for skinny, hard bias ply tires. Radials will benefit from a different set up. Ask them to provide as much caster as possible, up to 4 degrees. Get 0 to -.5 degrees negative camber. Finally, 1/16 toe in.

Offline TRIPLE-GREEN

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 605
    • Coupe Custom Accessories
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2009 - 05:37:42 PM »
I owe you a beer my friend! THANKS YOU!!  :cheers:

Offline lemming303

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1241
  • San Antonio, TX
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2009 - 09:42:48 PM »
Wow HP that is a lot of info!
Kevin

73 Challenger Rallye - first project

Offline 73EStroker

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1343
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2009 - 10:06:27 PM »
I am running a 0.92 torsion bar, aluminized BB engine, poly bushings throughout the entire car and Edelbrock shocks all round. Rides fairly firm and corners pretty good. Make sure you put the silicone grease on the poly bushings. No squeaks. I recommend the polys simply for the better handling.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2009 - 10:09:55 PM by 73EStroker »
Barry (Salmon Arm)

Offline dodj

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 6197
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2009 - 11:03:54 PM »
I have the pst poly bushings, 'improved handling' B/RB Mopar Performance torsion bars and pst 1 1/8" front and 7/8" rear sway bars. I would recommend the pst poly bushings. I wouldn't go back to rubber.
Scott
1973 Challenger  440 4 spd 
2007.5 3500 6.7 Cummins Diesel, Anarchy tuned.
Good friends don't let friends do stupid things. ........alone.

Offline Chryco Psycho

  • Administrator
  • C-C.com Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 36620
  • 70 Challenger R/T SE 70 tube Chassis Cuda now sold
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2009 - 11:40:25 PM »
I use the Energy Poly bushings on virtually all builds , they definatly help the tight feel of the front end
 the Tbars have a given spring rate as in x amount of Lbs moves the front end 1" down so adjusting the T bar will have no effect on the spring rate , but it will alter the height , to increase the front end stiffness the spring rate / bar diameter has to be increased .
 In a test I saw years ago it was far superior to increase the sway bar rate & keep a lighter spring in place so the tire would stay in contact with the road better & not Chatter on rougher surfaces but I still feel that the  springs need to be stiffer than the factory spec

Challenger - You`ll wish You Hadn`t

Offline Bullitt-

  • Permanent Resident
  • *******
  • Posts: 12167
  • Better Things To Come Member Since 2/16/06
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2009 - 12:33:34 AM »
And don't forget the shocks...a good firm handling shock can change the characteristics considerably. See what CUDA JAS has to say.. http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=60856.0
Wade  73 Rallye 340..'77 Millennium Falcon...13 R/T Classic   Huntsville, AL
Screwed by Photobucket!

Offline TRIPLE-GREEN

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 605
    • Coupe Custom Accessories
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2009 - 11:16:26 AM »
 :popcorn: - This is great -  :popcorn:

Offline HP2

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 4478
Re: Suspention Rebuild (BUSHINGS AND TORSION BARS)
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2009 - 08:45:43 AM »
Heck, I've had rubber that squeaked, so it isn't immune to it either.