Tire wear question

[shadango]

Last winter all new front end parts went into the fish.....including the "problem solver" upper a arm bushings, reversed the install to gain the extra camber.  Also went with the CAP strut bars.

Used the specs that have been floating around here, using more camber.

Finding that the outer edge of my front tires are wearing thin.

I am planning new meats all around (going to larger tires in back and front and will probably crank up the 1"  t-bars in the front just a bit to bring the nose up a bit.

But what is causing this outer edge tire wear?  Tracks good and doesn't drift or anything...

Would like to figure this out before the new tires are on.

[HP2]

Excessive postive camber or excessive toe in.

Did you get a read out of the alignment specs once it was done to verify they did what you wanted? Double check upper arm eccentrics to make sure they were tight?

[shadango]

Excessive postive camber or excessive toe in.

Did you get a read out of the alignment specs once it was done to verify they did what you wanted? Double check upper arm eccentrics to make sure they were tight?

I dont remember getting a printout....have to check my records.....(geez the old brain is getting forgetful).

Wondering...would raising the torsion bars a bit cause camber to change at all?   

[dodj]

Yes I think it would. Not a huge difference though. Try to keep it as low as possible and still give you the clearance needed to turn. Keeps the body roll to a minimum on corners. 

[CID440]

Yep too much pos camber and toe in,  I personally run -1.5 camber and 1 degree toe in and the tires wear even.  Not to mention it corners better.

Unfortunately the ride height is forever changing so the alignment specs do as well.   I hate torsion bars lol

[shadango]

Yes I think it would. Not a huge difference though. Try to keep it as low as possible and still give you the clearance needed to turn. Keeps the body roll to a minimum on corners. 

I am planning on changing tire height all the way around the car....I currently have 195/60/15 on the front and plan on trying to go to 225 or 235.....(I have 235 currently in the rear and am going to a 275/60/15)........so I know I will need to bump the front height a little.....I had the car aligned at the start of last season after a front end rebuild like I said....gave the guy the specs I found here (extra camber)......so not sure what happened....if the alignment was bogus to begin with, if something moved, or what.....

Found my old post here from a few days before i took it in for the alignment and seems I was going to use these specs (provided by 500stroker at the time)....

Caster 4.0*
Camber -0.5*
Toe in 1/8"

So it would seem that my camber has gone waaaaaay positive.

trying to recall if I tweaked the torsion bars up at all after the alignment..I dont think i did.....

Now wondering if the guy screwed up to start with....I mean, if one side were worn I could see it being a bad part etc......but both sides are worn about the same....sure seesm to point owards a bad setting to me.

What role do the strut bars play in alignment?  I know I had to tinker with those just a bit...i have the CAP dynamic strut bars and I had to re-clock the front joints a bit.....was careful not to change the length...

I think maybe I need to find a good Mopar alignment guy in my area....

[femtnmax]

Maybe take the car to a different alignment shop, unless you turned torsion bars or such after the alignment was set.
All is correct from other posts that camber and toe-in are the tire wearing adjustments.  Caster is directional control.
When your raise/lower the vehicle height the steering center link is held in place and rises/falls with the vehicle;  while the outer tie rod ends stay with the front wheel spindles which pivot about the ball joints. Hard to explain clearly but the toe-in changes with change in vehicle ride height; thus one of the tire wearing adjustments has been changed when you tinker with torsion bar adjustment.
Decades ago I used to work at car and semi-truck alignment shops,  your question is good for making me rethink all this.

[dodj]

What role do the strut bars play in alignment?  I know I had to tinker with those just a bit...i have the CAP dynamic strut bars and I had to re-clock the front joints a bit.....was careful not to change the length...

They are there to prevent forward and rearward movement of the lca. They move in an arc which imparts some forward/rearward motion, but for the most part locate the lca.

[HP2]

If they didn't provide a print out of the final results, it is all speculation on our part. They may have set them wrong from the get go and once you raised the ride height later, it just excerbated the problem.

Before you do it again, several things to consider, 1) have your chosen tire diameters set all the way around. If you have it aligned now and change tires, you will again add a variable which can impact alignment. 2) set you ride height were you want it and ask your specs to be set at that ride height, not the factory height. 3) when you provide your specs, point out they are in inches, not degrees. 4) requested a print out of the completed work so you can see how close to your request they were able to get.

You might look through your local phone book and find a chassis builder that makes oval track or sports cars chassis. Call them and see if they can do alignment or recommend someone who can. They typical chain store guys can read the book, twist the wrench, and align all the lasers to a tenth of an degree, but may not know some of the more intricate parts of making it work together and understanding why your asking for a deviation from stock. Sports car and oval track guys will get it and help you get there.

[shadango]

If they didn't provide a print out of the final results, it is all speculation on our part. They may have set them wrong from the get go and once you raised the ride height later, it just excerbated the problem.

Before you do it again, several things to consider, 1) have your chosen tire diameters set all the way around. If you have it aligned now and change tires, you will again add a variable which can impact alignment. 2) set you ride height were you want it and ask your specs to be set at that ride height, not the factory height. 3) when you provide your specs, point out they are in inches, not degrees. 4) requested a print out of the completed work so you can see how close to your request they were able to get.

You might look through your local phone book and find a chassis builder that makes oval track or sports cars chassis. Call them and see if they can do alignment or recommend someone who can. They typical chain store guys can read the book, twist the wrench, and align all the lasers to a tenth of an degree, but may not know some of the more intricate parts of making it work together and understanding why your asking for a deviation from stock. Sports car and oval track guys will get it and help you get there.

Thanks.....great advise there.

I was thinking that would be the right process...glad to see someone confirm that.

I have the names of some local shops that are classic car and/or Mopar classic car literate....so gonna try one of them I guess.

I am still trying to decide on the tire size.... ...then I will have to schedule the alignment to fall soon after the tires come in/are installed......

[swede-cuda]

 :wave:hej.i need to double check this/is it right that when doing alignment that the specs are given in inches,not degrees?i know that the ride-height is measured in inches" but ive always thought that caster,camber etc,measurements where given in degrees

[HP2]

The biggest issue is the toe in. Most of the specs that are thrown out on web boards talk about toe in as inches and caster/camber as degrees. There are some shops out there that use degrees to talk about everything, so if you ask for a eighth of toe in and they give you an eighth of a degree, it is a different measurement than an eight of an inch. That also is total toe combined so it breaks out to a .0625 inch per tire of toe. Honestly, I don't know the degree equivilent, I'm not an alignment tech. I do these in my garage using a tape measure, so I use inches.