tie rod adjustment running out of adjustment for alignment

[crash340]

Ok so here we go.
I have installed fast ratio arms that I picked up from FF, the pitman arm does not have a master spline to match the steering box, no big deal. i have also picked up some HD tie rod ends and arms from FF, again all good.
But, when I grabed the original arms to set up the new ones to roughly what was needed I noticed ones side the ends were wound almost all the way in, the other arm the ends had approx 3/4' thread exposed.
Anyway, moving on I put all the front end it, and just eyeballing the discs to be pointing roughly forward and straight, again same thing is happening with the tie rod ends, one side is wound all the way in and basically out of adjustment, the other is about 3/4" of thread showing, slip the pitman arm around one tooth and now the adjustments are about the same but on opposite sides now,
In order to have the both sides basically ballanced, its almost looking like I will have to cut a new master spline on the sterring shaft input shaft spline so as the steering box when held straight is actually rotated a small amount from center.

  

[anlauto]

Just to clarify.... Are you saying the one (say driver's side) tie rod assembly (including inner and outer tie rod ends and adjuster shaft) is adjusted "all the way in" with no threads showing, and the other side (say passenger's side) shows about 3/4 worth of threads on both the inner/outer tie rod ends....

OR

Are you saying that on both sides of the car, one tie rod end is "in all the way" and the other tie rod end shows 3/4 threads ?

[crash340]

your first statement Alan, one side, both ends are wound in, the other side both ends have about 3/4" thread, rotate the pitman arm one notch around and the sides swap, I need half a notch on the pitman arm if you will, which is not an option,

[edl94]

Drop the tie rod ends screw the long one in 1/2 way or 7/16" and screw the short one out the same amount. Then reattach the ends and you should be centered. Make sure the steering wheel is centered and proceed from there.

[crash340]

And thats why Im on here, someone always chimes in with a basic common sense answer that solves the problem. As they say, cant see for looking. thats the info I needed thanks EDL94

Greg

[anlauto]

  Yup....edl94 beat me to it ! I was going to say you need to start with both tie rod assemblies roughly the same length.

[crash340]

thats what I did, I had even amounts of thread on both ends of the rods, thats the problem, to get it straight one set are screwed all the way in, the other set is out, move one spline on the pitman and the oppposite rods get screwed in the other out, so what I actually need to do is have each rod not even amounts of thread at each end, That is shorten one rod and lengthen the other by adjusting one end only before putting it on the car.

[Chryco Psycho]

Ok try this , center the steering box by counting turns lock to lock & go back to center with tierods disconnected , is the steering wheel upside down ?
If so that will solve the problem , you need to disassemble the coupler , turn the column 1/2 turn & slide it back together , the will put the pitman arm 1/2 way between the spline positions .

[crash340]

Ok, everything was spot on straight before I pulled the front end out, I still have the old tie rod ends and links all still togeather as they came out of the car these are pretty much the same length and adjusted evenly so look normal, the lengths match on one side, old to new on one side but are about a good 1/2" longer than the other side, cant figure it out. I will have to probably get it on the ground, it maybe just because its up in the air and hanging.

CP isnt the steering column coupler master splined lide the input shaft? I have not had one apart to check, or is the master spline on the input shaft just an indicator

[Strawdawg]

Since everything is exactly the same as it was before, you cannot have a problem.   

But, you do have a problem.  Instead of trying to reason why something cannot be the cause, just check it like CP suggested...if it comes out right, then you can cross that off the list

Did you pull the pittman arm off?

When you turn the driver's side tie rod sleeve counterclockwise looking from the drivers wheel, does the tire turn to the left?  When you turn the passenger side clockwise looking from the passenger wheel side, does the wheel turn to the left?

[Chryco Psycho]

the coupler is master splined on the steering box shaft , but the column can slide into the coupler 2 ways 180* different , it may have been assembled incorrectly

[crash340]

Ok, I think I have found the issue.
its in the fast ratio arm, because its not a straight arm that is longer, as we know its a curved arm that is longer by about an Inch. when compared to the std pitman arm, when on a steering box, the ball joint possition is no on the same line front to back as the original, it actually sits either about 3/8" either to the left or the right pending which spline its on.
Now, what I have done is disconnected the pitman arm from the box, centred the centre link, evenly between the torsion bars as a guid, aligned the wheels to be both pointing directly forward, adjusted both left and right tie rods to suit and now they both have equal amounts of thread exposed and with adjustability, all looks perfect, then I rotated the steering wheel until the box splines and the pitman arm splines aligned to enable the arm to fit. what ended up was the steering wheel now sits either at 10.00 or 2.00 o'clock pending which way I turned the wheel to align the spline ( previously, the car drove perfectly straight with the steering wheel at 12.00 TDC.

In the pic below, you will see the master spline marked and the now TDC to enable correct steering adjustment. I could from here just pop the wheel off and align it at tdc but Im awaiting info from FF in ref to not having the input master spline not at TDC.

[1 Wild R/T]

The Steering box must be centered... And here's why... The worm & sector are ground in such a way that the mesh is tight on center but looser off center,  when your turning the gear mesh is forced tight by the self centering action caused by the caster built into the alignment but on center a loose mesh would allow the vehicle to wander... So if you set the steering gear up so straight ahead isn't at the center of the gear mesh you'll have loose on center steering... If you tighten the steering box to get a tight feel in what is the straight ahead position the gears will bind going across the center mesh point...

The Steering wheel & upper shaft is index splined, the steering box & coupler are index splined, the center point of the steering gear should occur when the missing (index) spline is at TDC....

Also if you look at the coupler body it has a notch on the outside edge that is in line with the index spline... The lower steering shaft has a drilled hole to help ID it's indexing to the coupler body...

The Flat of the coupler body will be at TDC when the steering gear is on center... So about 50-60 degrees rotation to the right....

Hopefully this makes sense..

[mopar jack]

I had this same problem and it's the pitman arm. The splines are cut about a half spline off center. If you move the arm one spline to the right or left the offset follows it. I took the arm and mounted it on a shaft and noticed that there are 36 splines which equals 10 degrees per spline and in turn equaled about an 1 1/2 inches of travel at the end. I talked to firm feel Dick and the only solution was to cut the spline on the steering wheel to center it  with the tie rods at equal adjustment.

[1 Wild R/T]

I had this same problem and it's the pitman arm. The splines are cut about a half spline off center. If you move the arm one spline to the right or left the offset follows it. I took the arm and mounted it on a shaft and noticed that there are 36 splines which equals 10 degrees per spline and in turn equaled about an 1 1/2 inches of travel at the end. I talked to firm feel Dick and the only solution was to cut the spline on the steering wheel to center it  with the tie rods at equal adjustment.

Wrong Solution Period... Read my above post for the full explanation.... The solution is to fix the damn Pitman Arm...