elec fan/shroud and alt choice?

[CUDA8U]

 i'm looking at cooling down my 512 stroker with a 22" champion rad (already in) and buying an aluminum shroud with 2-10" fans,also which alt is a good choice to upgrade to...100 amp plus? The stroker only gets hot in traffic or low speed driving,160* on highway.I read other forums and some like the shrouds and some don't and say it blocks air and the champion brand fans are junk. What to do?

[maddawg57]

I had a 512 in my 71 gtx , I ran a 26" champion with a stock shroud and a flexalite fan and it would not go over 185 sitting in traffic on the hottest day. 22" is rather small for your engine. Also if you want to go the electric fan route speedway motors sells cooling components electric fans in just about any size you could want comes with shroud and all wich is trimable to your application . I ran one on my 31 blown coupe and it worked great . Puller fans work muck better than pushers. I honestly do not think your 22" radiator is going to cool your engine .

[maddawg57]

Defiantly yes on the shroud , with out one no fan is going to work efficiently. 

[brads70]

I've had two different electric fans, spent too much money on them and going back to a engine fan because in traffic it gets too hot. 

[BS CUDA]

I've had two different electric fans, spent too much money on them and going back to a engine fan because in traffic it gets too hot. 

Same experience here - back to stock fan all has been cool since.

[72bluNblu]

I had the opposite problem with the 340 in my Duster. Yes, I know, it's a Duster but it actually uses the same 26" 3 core Champion radiator that was intended for an E-body.  Even though it's a .060" over 340 with 9.8:1 compression, ported 308 iron heads, and a Lunati 60404 cam I was running too COLD when I was just running a mechanical flex fan (no clutch). Took forever to warm up.

Anyway, I got a set of electric fans courtesy of a 1995-2000 Ford Contour. Dual electric fans, high and low speed, with a shroud that fits the 26" Champion radiator like it was made for it. These fans flow 3500 cfm on the high setting, which is more than all but the most expensive aftermarket set ups out there. A lot more than Champion's set up. To get it mounted I added a couple of 1/8" by 2" aluminum bar, and used the original mounting brackets on the fan.



I actually bought the fans new (Dorman 620-104) because the plastic fan shroud section always seem to be broken on the ones at the yard by some yahoo pulling other parts, or maybe because they're so crammed in there on the Contour's. But I went to the local PickNPull anyway and picked up a spare set up (with original Bosch motors) that had the complete harness still attached. Even though the shroud was broken, the price was worth it just for the harness, the fan connectors are like $12 each new, and you need 3. The entire set up is routed through a Dakota Digital controller, PAC-2750. It lets you program all the on/off temps, uses my autometer water temp gauge sending unit, and even allows me to program the fans to run after shut down for up to 5 minutes (and kills the fans if the battery gets low. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/dak-pac-2750/overview/

I did have to buy an extra relay for the dual fan set up http://www.summitracing.com/parts/dak-rly3/overview/

Anyway, the final product.  Fan installed with 180* thermostat. No more flex fan, more horsepower, and shorter warm up times. No overheating issues either, even when it's 100*F out the fans still cycle. I did also install a Tuff Stuff 100 amp alternator, which you can see in the pictures as well.

[CUDA8U]

I had the opposite problem with the 340 in my Duster. Yes, I know, it's a Duster but it actually uses the same 26" 3 core Champion radiator that was intended for an E-body.  Even though it's a .060" over 340 with 9.8:1 compression, ported 308 iron heads, and a Lunati 60404 cam I was running too COLD when I was just running a mechanical flex fan (no clutch). Took forever to warm up.

Anyway, I got a set of electric fans courtesy of a 1995-2000 Ford Contour. Dual electric fans, high and low speed, with a shroud that fits the 26" Champion radiator like it was made for it. These fans flow 3500 cfm on the high setting, which is more than all but the most expensive aftermarket set ups out there. A lot more than Champion's set up. To get it mounted I added a couple of 1/8" by 2" aluminum bar, and used the original mounting brackets on the fan.



I actually bought the fans new (Dorman 620-104) because the plastic fan shroud section always seem to be broken on the ones at the yard by some yahoo pulling other parts, or maybe because they're so crammed in there on the Contour's. But I went to the local PickNPull anyway and picked up a spare set up (with original Bosch motors) that had the complete harness still attached. Even though the shroud was broken, the price was worth it just for the harness, the fan connectors are like $12 each new, and you need 3. The entire set up is routed through a Dakota Digital controller, PAC-2750. It lets you program all the on/off temps, uses my autometer water temp gauge sending unit, and even allows me to program the fans to run after shut down for up to 5 minutes (and kills the fans if the battery gets low. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/dak-pac-2750/overview/

I did have to buy an extra relay for the dual fan set up http://www.summitracing.com/parts/dak-rly3/overview/

Anyway, the final product.  Fan installed with 180* thermostat. No more flex fan, more horsepower, and shorter warm up times. No overheating issues either, even when it's 100*F out the fans still cycle. I did also install a Tuff Stuff 100 amp alternator, which you can see in the pictures as well.

TOO BAD I HAVE THE 22"

[72bluNblu]

TOO BAD I HAVE THE 22"

I believe that you can do something similar with a Ford Taurus fan. Not exactly sure of the years, but it would go up to 1995 as it was the one that was replaced with the Contour at the time. It's a single, but still pulls about 3000 cfm and fits the 22" radiator. Lemme see if I can find info on it...

[Giveitawack]

440, 26" radiator. Stock fan, shroud, heater.
Now there are no overheatings. Even in traffic on hot days.
But I'm thinking...could the engine oil get too hot? Would an oil cooler be needed?

[72bluNblu]

440, 26" radiator. Stock fan, shroud, heater.
Now there are no overheatings. Even in traffic on hot days.
But I'm thinking...could the engine oil get too hot? Would an oil cooler be needed?

If the engine isn't overheating, the oil isn't likely to be getting too hot. 

There are exceptions, like if you're running a turbocharger that's fed using the engine oil (most are). In that case, oil temps inside the turbo can break down the oil faster. But unless you're talking turbo's or severe duty on the race track, it's unlikely you're overheating the engine oil without overheating the engine. You could add an oil cooler to assist in cooling, but if you're not overheating it really isn't going to benefit you. And you do want to keep your engine up to temperature, there is such a thing as running it too cold also.

Oh, and I found the info on the Taurus fan for 22" radiators.

The Taurus fan is listed for 1990-1995, it came with the 3.8L V6 Taurus' and Sable's. The Dorman replacement number is #620-101. It will fit on the 22" radiator just fine. The low speed pulls 3200 cfm and the high speed runs at 5800 cfm  . No kidding. Tell that to your aftermarket $300+ fans. Most folks use a simple thermostatic switch to control the on/off and only use the low speed, but you could do the same set up I did with the Dakota Digital controller and program temperature ranges for the low and high speeds.

[burdar]

That's the fan I was planning on installing on my 22". The lip on the drivers side of the fan steps up. I originally thought that the lip stayed flat so I could tuck it up underneath the radiators side brackets. I might get one from a salvage yard to test so I'm not out much money if I don't like the way it looks. Over on FABO, it was suggested to replace the motors if you get one from a salvage yard. I guess Ford had issues with those motors failing to turn on. RockAuto has the motors AND completely new motor/shroud combos. The complete combos are just a few bucks more then the motors by themselves. I was going to buy a brand new setup sice they are so close in price.

I haven't been able to find a measurement on the depth of that fan. I know the motor is offset but I only have 2 3/4" to work with.

[burdar]

OK, after my reply, I did some checking and found a fan at a yard near by.  I went and picked it up for $20.  I don't think I can use it on my Dart but there should be a lot more room on an E-body.  I might try and cut this thing up and try to make it work...I might not.

The depth of the shroud is 5" to the very center(top) of the motor.  It will be offset a little bit so you won't need quite 5" in front of the water pump pulley.  The fan blade itself is 15.5" in diameter.  Hopefully guys with 22" radiators in an E-body can use these.

[crash340]

I'm running a fixed flexifan and my car runs great temp wise, id love to go electric fan simply to keep engine noise down, as modern cars are all electric fans, surely we could make these systems like the ford units listed above etc work well?? and automatically control the engine temp by running temp sender units and so on to be set and forget
What seems to be the biggest problem people have found converting to Elec fans.?? Oh, also, my preference is to leave the factory radiator rather than go aluminium for now.

[72bluNblu]

OK, after my reply, I did some checking and found a fan at a yard near by.  I went and picked it up for $20.  I don't think I can use it on my Dart but there should be a lot more room on an E-body.  I might try and cut this thing up and try to make it work...I might not.

The depth of the shroud is 5" to the very center(top) of the motor.  It will be offset a little bit so you won't need quite 5" in front of the water pump pulley.  The fan blade itself is 15.5" in diameter.  Hopefully guys with 22" radiators in an E-body can use these.

Are you sure that's a fan from a 3.8L Taurus?

I ask because it does make a difference, and the one you show looks a little different than the Dorman version I posted above. Other V6 versions of the Taurus got a different fan that looks, but is not, the same. If you look on Rockauto at the fans for the different engine offerings, you'll see that they have different part #'s and dimensions. Only the one that goes to the 3.8L Taurus works well for our applications. The the shrouds are larger for the other models. The one that corresponds to the Dorman 620-101 is the one you want.

The Contour fan I'm using is ~3.5" deep to the motors, but they're offset from the pulley's so there's more room than that to work with. I know I've seen the 22" Taurus fans used on A-bodies, although I don't know the specific set up. And since I haven't personally run it, I don't know how thick the Dorman 620-101 is. How is it that you only have 2 3/4" to work with?

I'm running a fixed flexifan and my car runs great temp wise, id love to go electric fan simply to keep engine noise down, as modern cars are all electric fans, surely we could make these systems like the ford units listed above etc work well?? and automatically control the engine temp by running temp sender units and so on to be set and forget
What seems to be the biggest problem people have found converting to Elec fans.?? Oh, also, my preference is to leave the factory radiator rather than go aluminium for now.

The information I posted is exactly how to make all of it work. The Contour fans on my Duster are controlled with a programmable controller, the Dakota Digital PAC2750. With that I can program the fan on and fan off temperatures for both the low and high speed settings on the fan. I can also change that from the controller in the cabin with a pretty short programming sequence. Or just leave it velcro'ed under my dash and forget about it, which is pretty much what I've done since I installed it and got it programmed.

As far as the biggest issue, its the wiring. Installing the fan(s) onto the radiator is a piece of cake. Wiring it all into our cars so they don't burst into flames is more of a challenge. I run a 100 amp alternator to feed the fans, although you can get by with less. I still have the standard amp gauge and bulkhead connector, but I also have a continuous duty relay that's set up off of my trunk mounted battery, and the fan wiring is pulled off of the CDR. The bulkhead connector is still the weak link in my set up, but I'm almost ready to do the ammeter to voltmeter conversion/bypass, so that should eliminate that as an issue as well.

[burdar]

Yes, that's a 90-95 Taurus 3.8l fan.  All the other single Contour fans have a lot smaller shroud. I was going to cut an inch off the back side but the fan is already very close to the core. This will not work in an A-body with a cc526 rad and the 70+ water pump. Maybe the cc2374 rad is set back farther. I'm sure there is more room in an E-body.