SUSPENSION AND STEERING UPGRADES A LITTLE AT A TIME

[john h]

Hi all,

I have been thinking about all the different upgrades out there and I have a few questions.  I can't afford the $4-5K to do a complete upgrade at 1 time so I need to do small upgrades and add ons.  what is going to give me the most bang for my buck?  what order should I upgrade my suspension and steering components to get the biggest change/upgrade first moving to the least important factors at the tail end until I have a complete upgrade?  2 years ago I did a full front end restoration with new bushings, shocks etc. but It did not do as much for my ride and wandering steering as I had hoped. 

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
JOhn

[Fred]

The first thing I added was a rear sway bar.

My wandering totally stopped when I changed the front tires from 60's to 235's (narrower).

Good luck!

[john h]

The first thing I added was a rear sway bar.

My wandering totally stopped when I changed the front tires from 60's to 235's (narrower).

Good luck!

Thanks for the idea.  I already have front and rear sway bars. (factory)  I could possibly look into the larger diameter ones......

[burdar]

What shocks and what size torsion bars are you running?  Larger bars and quality shocks(NOT CHEAP MONROES) will do a lot.  Also, reinforcing the LCA's can help as well.  What are you running for a steering box?  Changing to a Firm Feel stage 2 or 3 would be a great upgrade to start with IMO.  The stock loose steering feel can make these cars feel unsafe to drive.

[brads70]

  Bigger torsion bars and GOOD shocks! I'd also suggest a front end alignment from a shop with experience. The "book specs" were for bias ply tires and will not give good results.

[john h]

What shocks and what size torsion bars are you running?  Larger bars and quality shocks(NOT CHEAP MONROES) will do a lot.  Also, reinforcing the LCA's can help as well.  What are you running for a steering box?  Changing to a Firm Feel stage 2 or 3 would be a great upgrade to start with IMO.  The stock loose steering feel can make these cars feel unsafe to drive.

I have the stock torsion bar.  Not sure what diameter that would be. I am also running the basic Monroe shock.  I still have the old steering box.  I would like to go to Rack and pinion eventually if that would be an upgrade over the firm feel stage 2 box.  Coil overs would be the eventual choice.  if I spend the money on good shocks I may be wasting it when I do switch.  I'm starting to see that my goal of making minor tweaks may make me spend money that gets wasted later.

[burdar]

I'm starting to see that my goal of making minor tweaks may make me spend money that gets wasted later.

Depending on what your ultimate goal is, YES that might be a possibility.  However, with the right modifications, you may not feel the need to go all the way with coil overs and a rack.

What I would do is this...
1.Reinforce the K-member.(completely weld the perimeter and box in the steering mounts)
2.Reinforce the lower control arms.(weld stiffening plates across the bottom and add a strap back by the torsion bar socket)
3.Firm feel stage 2 or 3 steering box.(or to keep costs down, install shims in PS pump to lower the pressure)
4.Research torsion bar sizes to see what's available. (1"plus bars)
5.Quality shock
6.Depending on the results of 1-5, look into larger sway bars.

EDIT:  You might want to look into #5 first.  That will really help the "feel" of the car. 

[anlauto]

Best bang for the buck would be a Stage III Firm Feel steering box

[HP2]

Okay, so we've got somewhat of a budget and a time frame limitation to understand the progress.  These means you want bang for the buck first followed by incremental improvements that don't back track on previous spending.  What are you expecting to achieve with these updates/upgrades and how do you intend on using the car?  I ask because you mention coil overs and R&P, which are very fancy, very expensive, and not necessary in a vast number of builds but many guys think they have to have these to improve their steering and suspension systems because they are "new tech." The original Mopar design was actually way ahead of its time in capability and it only has a few significant drawbacks that can be overcome pretty easily without spending a fortune.

[john h]

Okay, so we've got somewhat of a budget and a time frame limitation to understand the progress.  These means you want bang for the buck first followed by incremental improvements that don't back track on previous spending.  What are you expecting to achieve with these updates/upgrades and how do you intend on using the car?  I ask because you mention coil overs and R&P, which are very fancy, very expensive, and not necessary in a vast number of builds but many guys think they have to have these to improve their steering and suspension systems because they are "new tech." The original Mopar design was actually way ahead of its time in capability and it only has a few significant drawbacks that can be overcome pretty easily without spending a fortune.

you sumarized my process well.  I just want a nice handling driver.  I don't race I just want to drive.  I drive a lot of out of the way county roads that are windy.  it's never just a nice cruise through the sweeping corners.  Add a little speed say 50 MPH and the front end gets really light. over steer under steer you never can tell.  I have a 2011 Dodge avenger and that's like a sports car compared to this Cuda.  my wife's 2012 Town and Country Van out handles this thing.  The rough ride Keeps the wife from wanting to go cruising (sometimes not a bad thing) and feeling like I'm turning a 1/2 turn of the wheel before the front end moves has to go. I also have headers that drop low to get the drag link through and they are very close to the ground on the drivers side.  I would like some extra clearance with different headers.  they are almost worn through from rubbing the ground when just driving down a hill to a flat part of the road. the ride height is set to stock.  Maybe I have watched too many car shows on Velocity channel and these are not supposed to ride like new cars?  I was just  thinking some improvements each year and eventually, I would have modern suspension.  OH BTW, I still have 14 Tires.  I'm planning on going to 16 or 17 hoping that will help some but I have not decided how much side wall I want.  Some balance between rubber band and 70 profile I think.  I don't want to start trimming fender lips etc.

Thanks guys.  I appreciate the opinions.

[burdar]

Check out this article.  This would lower your PS pressure and tighten up the steering.  A stage 2 or 3 box would also do it.
http://www.moparaction.com/tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf

[crash340]

Go stage III, I have a stage II and wished I had of gone to a III. also, a set of offset UCA bushes to assist with the wheel alignment, easy and cheap and WELL worth it.

[jordan]

   You have lots going on.  Bang for the buck in my opinion would be tires and rims.  The year one 17" rims are reasonably priced and fit.  Good rubber will be a huge different feel compared to the 14" wheels.  Next would be the stage 2 or 3 firm feel box.  Great feel, and a lot more precision.  To help with bottoming out, get a larger torsion bar set.  1" or bigger will control the front and keep it from crashing down.  High end shocks will keep it all in control.  These items you will feel instantly when you put them on.  Large diameter sway bars will greatly help your cornering without all the understeer.  Definitely a bolt on change you will feel instantly.  Adjustable upper control arms, sector shaft bearing, and frame bracing will all help the overall package.  The other suggestion such as welding the k-frame will help, but you won't necessarily feel the difference if that is the only thing you change.  Same with bracing the lower control arms. 

   The majority of your symptoms will be cured with wheels and tires, a new steering box, torsion bars, expensive shocks, and sway bars.  That will cost you a couple of grand plus, but will change your car more than you can believe.  Then do the little stuff that will add up over time. 

   Hotchkis TVS is a great start without going overboard with rack and pinion and coil overs.  Thats chevy crap. 

[john h]

Check out this article.  This would lower your PS pressure and tighten up the steering.  A stage 2 or 3 box would also do it.
http://www.moparaction.com/tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf

Thanks for the link.  That was some great info.  I think I wills tart there and at least have a better feel while I ponder my long term options.

[soundcontrol]

2.Reinforce the lower control arms.(weld stiffening plates across the bottom and add a strap back by the torsion bar socket)

Burdar, I'm in the process of adding the reinforcement plates on my LCA's, but what is the other mod? Any info/pictures on that anywhere?