Author Topic: Ignition switch pin (Read 8227 times)

jforest1 · « **on:** August 24, 2015 - 01:41:54 PM »

Hey guys.

I've had an electrical issue where the 'cuda dies while driving sporadically. I�ve had to throw the cautions on and crank in neutral while avoiding cars ramming me. In the past it happened on occasion now I cannot get out of the garage. It seems that upon re-cranking the engine, that most of the time it is most successful after releasing the key (that is, i turn the key, it starter tries to start the engine but fails for several seconds, I release the key and it spins back and as it does the engine fires).

I've replaced engine and dash side wiring harnesses, ignition coil, ignition switch, and I cannot remember which but others. I was told that the ignition switch has a pin that upon turning the key completes the circuit. This sounds like where a bad connection would be because it is mechanical I�m told based on the key turn.

1. What is this pin called?
2. Where is it located? Part of the ignition switch or external?
3. Where can I find the part? Again, part of the ignition switch or external? Because I know the ignition switched was replaced, I�m wondering if this is commonly failing part.

Thanks!

JF

mopar jack · « **Reply #1 on:** August 24, 2015 - 02:12:49 PM »

sounds like the ballast resister.

dutch · « **Reply #2 on:** August 24, 2015 - 04:19:45 PM »

jforest1 · « **Reply #3 on:** August 26, 2015 - 10:24:23 AM »

That was one of the first things replaced. I can try again though...

JF

Bullitt- · « **Reply #4 on:** August 26, 2015 - 10:43:42 AM »

test for power getting to & through the ballast while cranking... could be anything loose/broken/bad along the way.

mopar jack · « **Reply #5 on:** August 26, 2015 - 12:04:20 PM »

I had a problem with a new ignition switch where it connects to the harness at the coluum. The pin connectors don't seem to fit tight enough so pulled each pin out of the connector and gave it a little crimp with pliers. When the car is running I could reach the connector and move it and engine would cut off.

jforest1 · « **Reply #6 on:** August 27, 2015 - 11:42:38 AM »

Thanks Mopar Jack and Bullitt-. I think I'll try both of your suggestions.

Bullitt- when you say teste for power geteting to and through, can you be more specific? What should I be looking for on my meter?

JF

Bullitt- · « **Reply #7 on:** August 27, 2015 - 04:40:00 PM »

Ideally you would have whatever your battery voltage is but there is at best some loss through the wires & connections, should this loss be to great the car will be hard to start. Start the test at the ballast to determine if appropriate voltage is getting to it during Start, for these purposes I'll refer to it as 12VDC... if much less than that you have issues along the way that will need to be addressed.. If appropriate power is getting to the ballast check how much is getting through it. My ballast tested good with no load but was breaking down under load.. Using a multi-meter set to DC, find a solid earth ground & probe the connections while cranking for Start.

here's a good picture http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=73290.msg747450;topicseen#msg747450

dual ballast , (in schematic below the ballast is shown upside down from how the factory installed them) During START the Lower Plug BROWN should have about 12VDC, When key released goes to RUN the upper plug BLUE should get 12VDC.
In the Run position the lower plug GREEN/Red wire should show power reduced to about 5VDC going to the ECU & the lower plug BROWN wire will drop to about 8VDC going to the coil, this is your run power after the resistors drop the voltage

Strawdawg · « **Reply #8 on:** August 27, 2015 - 10:17:25 PM »

Looking at the diagram in the above post, you should have battery voltage at the brown wire at the ballast and at the coil when the key is held in the Start position.

If it does not, you have to find out why not.

I would go under the dash to the connector coming out of the steering column from the ignition switch. Look at the diagram I have attached. See the column with the two connectors coming out of it? One of them has a wire labelled 12BR. This is the brown wire that goes to the ballast/coil for starting.

When the key is held in the Start position, this wire should have battery voltage on it. Ground one probe on your meter and check both the in and out on the connector on the brown wire to see if power comes into the connector and if it goes out of the connector with power.

If it does not have power on the side coming out of the column, then you may have an ignition switch problem.
If you have power there, but not on the other side of the connector, then you would appear to have a connector problem.

If you have power there but not under the hood, it may be a bulkhead connector problem.

jforest1 · « **Reply #9 on:** August 29, 2015 - 01:45:04 PM »

In response to bullet-'s post,

Here's what I understand these to mean:
start position: turning past ACC mode where the stereo turns on, but before cranking, there seems to be a position of the key where electricity starts going to the ballast resister but not the starter.
cranking: starter motor is spinning
run: engine is running

Quote

During START the Lower Plug BROWN should have about 12VDC,

11.8vdc in start position,
11ish vdc while cranking

Quote

When key released goes to RUN the upper plug BLUE should get 12VDC.

9.5vdc while cranking
12vdc in acc mode (electrical on, not cranking)
1-12vdc while running (it drops down from 1 back up to 12vdc sporadically)

Quote

In the Run position the lower plug GREEN/Red wire should show power reduced to about 5VDC going to the ECU

12 vdc in start position
1-12vdc while running

Quote

the lower plug BROWN wire will drop to about 8VDC going to the coil, this is your run power after the resistors drop the voltage

10.8vdc in start position
1-9vdc while running

Two observations:
1. it seems the ballast resister is not reducing voltage as it should coming out of the green/red wire, but perhaps is as it comes out of the brown wire.
2. while running, the voltage is jumping all over the board. is this normal? if so, should i be looking at the ceiling/max voltage for the readings?

JF

Bullitt- · « **Reply #10 on:** August 29, 2015 - 01:54:29 PM »

Voltage should be pretty consistent..The BLUE wire that provides RUN power is obviously a problem... there is an issue upstream in the wiring that needs to be tracked down.
Start tracing that wire back to the next connection which I believe is the bulkhead connector & see what you get there. If still not consistent keep on tracing & checking. It could be anywhere all the way back to & including the ignition switch.

jforest1 · « **Reply #11 on:** August 29, 2015 - 03:09:42 PM »

thanks bullitt-!

so elementary question is what am I checking for as I go up the line?

ignition 1 (12DBL) from steering column disconnect fluctuates voltage (1-12dcv) from both sides of the disconnect.

12R from the same disconnect from the battery also does (note: ammeter bypass and drilled/run wire directly through bulkhead disconnect port so no connector there just wire), but isn�t the voltage from the battery going to equal what was requested from the components downstream?

so if a component is faulty, it may intermittently request power and so even if directly attached to the battery, voltage will be 12 when it needs it and 0 when it faults and doesn't draw power? if this is the case, and the ignition switch is the first component requesting power (starter switch i guess could as well), then doesn't that mean the ignition switch is the problem?

just trying to understand the troubleshooting logic here, as I've no problem understanding the wiring diagram and following the circuit.

JF

Bullitt- · « **Reply #12 on:** August 29, 2015 - 04:48:43 PM »

12VDC-measured from the connection to a good earth ground.. with the wide flat flat connector at the steering column still connected & the ignition switch in the RUN position you should see 12VDC in the 4th wire down per Stawdawgs diagram... right next to it is the large RED wire that supplies power into the ignition switch check that it's getting a steady 12VDC.
If the RED wire reads good & 4th does not then it pretty much has to be that connection or the ignition switch.

there doesn't have to be any draw to measure volts..... amps is where a draw is needed

jforest1 · « **Reply #13 on:** August 29, 2015 - 05:00:21 PM »

All three, while the car is running, fluctuate in VDC from 1-12:
1. 12DBL - ignition switch 1 (measured on both sides of disconnect)
2. 12BR - ignition switch 2 (measured on both sides of disconnect)
3. 12R - battery

JF

jforest1 · « **Reply #14 on:** August 29, 2015 - 05:20:02 PM »

Stand by... Think i found it.

JF

Author Topic: Ignition switch pin (Read 8227 times)

jforest1

Ignition switch pin

mopar jack

Re: Ignition switch pin

dutch

Re: Ignition switch pin

jforest1

Re: Ignition switch pin

Bullitt-

Re: Ignition switch pin

mopar jack

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jforest1

Re: Ignition switch pin

Bullitt-

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Strawdawg

Re: Ignition switch pin

jforest1

Re: Ignition switch pin

Bullitt-

Re: Ignition switch pin

jforest1

Re: Ignition switch pin

Bullitt-

Re: Ignition switch pin

jforest1

Re: Ignition switch pin

jforest1

Re: Ignition switch pin