70 T/A project car

[Rich G]

Taking a road trip this weekend to check out a T/A Challenger that was supposedly store in a garage with the ass end sticking outside for years. He claims the front is good but the back is bad. Assuming the car is all there and not a total POS what do you think would be a fair offer for the car. I know that's a tough answer not knowing all the details but just trying to get an idea. I'd be doing all the work myself so that would be a labor of love. Worth a look anyway. Nothing ventured nothing gained!

[67vertman]

Like you said to many unknowns and variables without details.

My two cents:

Needing most rear sheet metal, but all the original parts (motor, carbs, hood, trans, etc) there - $20,000 and up

Needing most rear sheet metal, but all the original parts (motor, carbs, hood, trans, etc) are not there - deduct what it cost to replace those parts.

Color, options, and condition will drive the price up or down as well.

Good luck on your hunt.  and whether or not you get it......we would love to see some pictures.

[340challconvert]

Ditto
Would love to see some pics
vertman pretty much nailed the purchase options
sheetmetal is expensive to replace contingent upon what is needed and would drive the price down.
Happy Hunting

[Beekeeper]

I looked at an original TA a couple years ago and it had every piece on the car in decent restorable condition. Needed rear quarters. It sold very quickly for 27k....to the second person who looked at it. In other words, he could have got more if he asked for it and held out a bit.

Given that this one needs more substantial rear work, if 100% complete and not needing other stuff like frame straightening, I'd say around 22k. Some may think that's high but I can see it selling for that unless it's actually worse than described.

[Katfish]

I'm no expert, but why in the world would you pay $25k for a basket case, then dump another $50k into over the course of 5-10yrs.
Can't you buy a decent T/A for $40-$60k?

[340challconvert]

Went to the Barrett Jackson research site
Interesting numbers
TA's in various colors and all very clean or restored or better sold for the following:

57.2K    yellow 4sp
115.5K  go mango 4sp
93.5K    yellow 4sp
74.8K    plum automatic
56.1K    blue automatic
59.4K    yellow automatic
67.1K    go mango 4sp
50.6K    red 4sp
78.1      panther pink 4 sp

Sales were from actual auctions from 2011 - 2017

The 115.5k sale was the oldest from Scottsdale in 2011
Interesting information

[Beekeeper]

I'm no expert, but why in the world would you pay $25k for a basket case, then dump another $50k into over the course of 5-10yrs.
Can't you buy a decent T/A for $40-$60k?

I must agree with you but when you boil it down, you could say the same thing about any classic car in need of major restoration. The reality is that even if the car is free, it will cost a small fortune to restore and you will be upside down in no time. Unless the car is highly collectible, you do it for the love of the work, not because you are trying to save money.

We all know that people do this everyday. Why? Most likely because they cannot justify emptying their savings account for a car that will deteriorate every day they enjoy it. Or maybe that don't have that kind of money at all or don't want to finance it. On the other hand, people do rationalize how they can scrape together $20k (usually less) for a basket case and slowly put money into it at a pace they can afford. Of course many folks also convince themselves they can do the work themselves. Some realize later they were wrong and sell.

I have a 70 RT that is in need of restoration. It's possible I might sell it and let someone else do it. But I know a quality restoration will run 40k plus. The car would only be worth 45k once finished. Am I obligated to sell my car for 5k to ensure the buyer isn't upside down on the car? If anyone tried to get me down on the price using that logic, I'd refuse to sell to him or her just on principle.

I like Vertmans guidelines on prices...I'd just keep those figures in my head when making your offer. It's a valuable car in any condition. I also like that you want to do the work yourself! I'm doing this on a car now and even have a thread going on it. Very satisfying to see it progress without having to pay other people labor.

[340challconvert]

I must agree with you but when you boil it down, you could say the same thing about any classic car in need of major restoration. The reality is that even if the car is free, it will cost a small fortune to restore and you will be upside down in no time. Unless the car is highly collectible, you do it for the love of the work, not because you are trying to save money.

We all know that people do this everyday. Why? Most likely because they cannot justify emptying their savings account for a car that will deteriorate every day they enjoy it. Or maybe that don't have that kind of money at all or don't want to finance it. On the other hand, people do rationalize how they can scrape together $20k (usually less) for a basket case and slowly put money into it at a pace they can afford. Of course many folks also convince themselves they can do the work themselves. Some realize later they were wrong and sell.

I have a 70 RT that is in need of restoration. It's possible I might sell it and let someone else do it. But I know a quality restoration will run 40k plus. The car would only be worth 45k once finished. Am I obligated to sell my car for 5k to ensure the buyer isn't upside down on the car? If anyone tried to get me down on the price using that logic, I'd refuse to sell to him or her just on principle.

I like Vertmans guidelines on prices...I'd just keep those figures in my head when making your offer. It's a valuable car in any condition. I also like that you want to do the work yourself! I'm doing this on a car now and even have a thread going on it. Very satisfying to see it progress without having to pay other people labor.

Beekeeper,
Like your thoughts on this!

[Beekeeper]

Thanks 340. Rich, I'd love to see some photos of the car whether you buy or not. I kinda regret not buying the TA I spoke about but I didn't have the room at the time. I really hope this car works out for you.

[MoparJunkie]

All I got out of this, is that beekeeper might want to sell his 70 RT What's the condition of your RT?

Haha on a serious note though I bought a project chally for the reasons beekeeper mentioned. It was much easier for me to justify spending money on a starter shell, than spending 30k+ for a fully done or mostly done chally. I can get my project done at my pace. I would prefer faster, but I'm a working guy like most people are and I unfortunately at times have other priorities. But even still, I'm just happy to have a project. Those RTs and TAs are great if you really want the rarity and matching numbers, but wow do you pay the price for the real deal vs just a clone. I get the appeal though I would love to own an original N96 shaker 4spd 440-4 or 440-6. Without knowing prices they are today, that's likely what I would have ordered had I been of driving age in 1970 lmao.

Post pics of the TA when you look at it! Details!

[jimynick]

"Without knowing prices they are today, that's likely what I would have ordered had I been of driving age in 1970 lmao."  Maybe not. The price of those cars in the 70's sounds pretty cheap today, but you need to remember that in my own scenario, I was working in a GM dealership in 1971 making $2.00 per hour as a newby apprentice. Yeah, that's $80 per week and that's before the tax man got done with you! So, we've got an annual income of $2080 before taxes and you've got to live somewhere, eat and drink and have some kind of a car. THAT'S why a lot of us didn't order that $5000 Challenger or Cuda! Just my 

[MoparJunkie]

"Without knowing prices they are today, that's likely what I would have ordered had I been of driving age in 1970 lmao."  Maybe not. The price of those cars in the 70's sounds pretty cheap today, but you need to remember that in my own scenario, I was working in a GM dealership in 1971 making $2.00 per hour as a newby apprentice. Yeah, that's $80 per week and that's before the tax man got done with you! So, we've got an annual income of $2080 before taxes and you've got to live somewhere, eat and drink and have some kind of a car. THAT'S why a lot of us didn't order that $5000 Challenger or Cuda! Just my 

Granted you made less money, but just out of curiosity what would the equivalent be like to trying to buy one new then with your 1970s salary and 1970s challenger vs present salary and what version of the challenger do you think compares to lets say a 1970 RT 440-4? So would buying a 70 RT 440-4 (or insert 426 if you wish) and financing that over 5 years be comparable to lets say a scat pack now? Or do you think it would be like the current RT 5.7? Just curious, because I could if I wanted to find a way to buy a new scat pack 392 and finance that, but I can't afford anything above likely an SRT8 (No hellcats or demons for me). I just keep hearing people say how ridiculously high the prices are now compared to how they used to be back then. How the average blue collar guy could afford one vs now with hellcats and demons they will likely not be sold to the average blue collar guy. Just curious your thoughts because it seems like (According to you) the 426 hemi price wise and even the RT itself was outside the range for most costing 5k or so.

[Beekeeper]

Granted you made less money, but just out of curiosity what would the equivalent be like to trying to buy one new then with your 1970s salary and 1970s challenger vs present salary and what version of the challenger do you think compares to lets say a 1970 RT 440-4? So would buying a 70 RT 440-4 (or insert 426 if you wish) and financing that over 5 years be comparable to lets say a scat pack now? Or do you think it would be like the current RT 5.7? Just curious, because I could if I wanted to find a way to buy a new scat pack 392 and finance that, but I can't afford anything above likely an SRT8 (No hellcats or demons for me). I just keep hearing people say how ridiculously high the prices are now compared to how they used to be back then. How the average blue collar guy could afford one vs now with hellcats and demons they will likely not be sold to the average blue collar guy. Just curious your thoughts because it seems like (According to you) the 426 hemi price wise and even the RT itself was outside the range for most costing 5k or so.

I figure there's a reason only a small percentage of muscle cars ever came with the top HP engines...most people couldn't afford it or more likely were unwilling to spend all their monthly money for it. Theres probably a few who didn't want the power I suppose. but if they sold hemi or six pack cars back then for slant six or 318 prices, I'm guessing that they wouldn't sell many slant sixes and 318s. We all want the power but there's a limit to what we are willing to shell out.

If you look at modern muscle cars like Challengers, mustangs, and Cameros, most are sold with V6 engines. They are okay but they still pale in comparison to the performance engines they offer. The more boxes you start checking off, the more difficult it is to justify the monthly payment.

I'm finally at a point in my life where I can afford the monthly payment on an incredible new 80-100k car but there is no way in hell I would blow every last penny of our monthly income on a toy that's really disposable after 10 years. I'd rather get the same car with a V6 and have money left over for vacations, going out to eat once in a while, etc. I suspect that was a common conversation people had back then too.

[jimynick]

I hear you and you're right about salaries and prices- to a degree. To correct my initial scenario, i'd have about $3500 a year left after the tax man and pension payments were made. A hemi car in those days ran about $5500 before taxes. Throw in $75 a month for rent ($900/yr) and you're down around $2400 left. That means I'd have to eat nothing, buy nothing, insure nothing, drive nothing and spend nothing on entertainment and it'd still take me 2.5 years to pay for the car not including taxes, insurance, gas or maintenance. The price of a new hot rod hemi is approximately 20 times what it was in the day (in Canadian dollars) and I'm not making $40/hr either. They were unreachable then and they're unreachable now. Should've stayed in school like mama said, eh? 

[MoparJunkie]

Overall, it sounds like cars prices now are higher vs what they were then (Adjusting salary to that era). Unfortunately that just makes getting into a car you really want harder, unless you're crazy and go for a 7 year payment plan, lol. In my 20s eating top ramen every night just to get that car I really wanted (or to buy go-fast parts) was something I would do, and did, lol. But later in life, I do enjoy NOT having car payments. I was just curious to think about what I could afford back then given a similar 70s salary. For example like I said I could afford a scat pack now if I really wanted to and granted back then I'd likely be like most and a big block might be hard to justify purchasing (unless I was in my reckless 20s lol). I would imagine like my uncle who owned 2 cudas both of which were 340s, that would be most likely the middle ground of what the average guy could buy. A peppy small block, with the RT big blocks and TAs going to those with deeper pockets. Just fun to think about. Luckily, even though I didn't grow up in that era, I am glad I can justify at least a project car, lol.

Personally I like the late model challengers overall, but they have been on the same platform for the challengers since 08'. Crazy to think they have been on a platform for almost 10 years, while the original challenger only was a 4 year run with styling changes pretty much every year. I wouldn't mind seeing a bit lighter chassis on the next gen, if there is a next gen challenger. If not, then I'll be looking for a used scat pack way down the road with the newer 71 cues, so I can park it next to my 71.