Firm Feel Rebuild?

Author Topic: Firm Feel Rebuild?  (Read 8429 times)

Offline V02Barracuda

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2013 - 12:44:13 PM »
In response to 70RAG383, the rim blow wheel provides too much leverage.  A friend of mine has a 71 Challenger, stage 2 box from FF but has a small tuffwheel and it has a real nice firm feel to it.  So for him, choosing stage 2 was the right thing to do. 

I'm not swapping steering wheels in my car.  I want to be able to read my gauges...........
 




Offline Mopar Mitch

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2013 - 02:53:03 PM »
As most of you know, I use my T/A for serious pylon autocross competition, as well as occasional hi-speed road course lapping events.  Although Ive never personally dealt with FF, I sooner or later will and have heard a majority of positives about their services and products.

For serious competition pylon autocrossing, the fastest steering is always needed.  I have the T/A gearbox, fast-ratio pitman arm, and of course the longer correct idler arm AND the Saginaw pump.   (Actually, back about 1975~6, I was aware of that problem with the factory incorrect idler arm and had a discussion with a Chrysler engineer who was also aware of it... also, fellow SCCA Solo II AAR racer John Sandberg was the first person to ever have this matter "in-print" via the SIAC newsletter.)

To further help with fast steering response, I've tried smaller steering wheels.. very good improvement!!!  The factory 14" diameter TUFF wheel is a big improvement over the other large factory wheels (although a little "slippery" of a grip).  I've also tried a very small 10" diameter Grant wheel... super quick response but my hands get twisted over each other.. too small!.  Ultimately, I've settled on a Superior brand 11.5" diameter deep-dish (~5.5") wheel... its great!!!!  (It does, however, block off partial view of the tach/speedo... no big deal to me... performance comes first!)

Anyway, I know my T/A gearbox could probably use a reconditioning.  The steering is still very quick and responsive, although it does appear to be a little loose and not firm or tight.   So, my concern would be to determine which level (1,2,3) would be absolute best for my needs -- quick steering response mandatory through fast pylon autocrossing -- it cannot allow resistance when I have to have the fastest steering response available.   

I imagine a level 2 or 3 would be great on the hi-speed tracks and cruising hwys, etc, but again, its the pylon autocrossing quick response requirement that concerns my eventual decision.  I wish I could eventually "test drive" the levels (1-2-3) and decide on my own.

Any thoughts/comments would be appreciated.
Autocross/road racers go in deeper... and come out harder!

See  MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, AUGUST 2006 ISSUE for featured article and details on my autocross T/A.

Offline duodec

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2013 - 09:50:16 PM »
Given your rather specific situation you should probably give them a call; Chryco recommended that to an earlier poster in this thread, and others have reported doing so for advice.

Offline BIGSHCLUNK

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2013 - 10:58:01 PM »
Bigs,
I have the 2.   do i wish i had the 3?  don't know as i haven't had a chance to drive one to see what it feels like.  But I do know i slide around in my stock Gran Coupe seats!!  I am gonna have to get some Velcro for by butt.

gotta quit using monkey snot! (amour all/ect) been there done that  :grinyes:
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Offline Topcat

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2013 - 09:21:44 PM »
Dennis at Firm feel replied back to me that my steering box is coming up in line for re build. Now I have decided to go level 3 from the feedback you guys have given me. Thanks!

Next question I have:

I sent them 2 steering boxes.

1. 71' OEM unit to my car with small sector shaft
2. 73' and up unit I picked up at a swap meet for dirt cheap.

The 71' has been smoothed out except the numbers. would look really good painted.
The 73' up is beefier sector shaft.

Is the 71' worth anything?
I have the pitman arm that's new already for the 73' up.

Is the 73' a no brainer to re build?
Mike, Fremont, CA.


Offline Topcat

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2013 - 09:26:26 PM »
FYI...

e-mail from Dennis.

The large sector shaft won’t fit into the small sector case.  We will have to use the large sector box if you want to use the ’73 up large sector pitman arm.  Let me know how to proceed, your order is coming up pretty quick in line.

Thanks, Dennis-FFI

I wanted to transfer 73 guts into 71' originally.
Now I have an extra core there they'll comp me for one way or the other.
Mike, Fremont, CA.


Offline tommyg29

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2013 - 10:22:15 PM »
I used steer and gear extra firm which is probably like firm feel stage 3.
I have a rimblow. Definitely do it. Makes it almost as firm as a modern car.
72 Roadrunner 400-4 Auto-3.23 Gear-Black Cruiser
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12 Dodge Charger SXT Plus Blacktop Package-3.6L-8 Sp-Leather-Nav (the wife's)

Multiple SRT's, Rams, Dakotas, Caravans and Neons

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Offline 72challenged

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2013 - 10:30:59 PM »
another vote for stage 3, I have the fast arms too! :cheers:

beer is good!

eh
72' Challenger Rallye, Lt Gunmetal Metallic, 360/4, 727, 8 3/4 sure grip, a/c ps pb, Bilsteins,  mini like wheels, BFG 245/60 15's

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Offline Mopar Mitch

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2013 - 11:40:59 AM »
With the Stage 3, can you whip the steering wheel back and forth (left-right-left-right...).. repeatedly without "undesirable resistance".. such as running through a long set of pylons?
Autocross/road racers go in deeper... and come out harder!

See  MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, AUGUST 2006 ISSUE for featured article and details on my autocross T/A.

Offline tommyg29

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2013 - 10:32:28 AM »
I autocross a stealth so I know what you mean about whipping back and forth around the pylons.
#3 or extra firm allows me to use 2 fingers to turn my rimblo on the street, instead of the one finger I needed before.
The stock feel was like piloting a yacht. Nebulous and too light. #3 is NOWHERE NEAR unassisted steering. Its not even as firm as my 2012 charger V6. Seriously, unless theres something wrong with my rebuild, the extra firm is no big deal. Its just much better than stock.
My rimblow measures just under 16" outside diameter, so I would think a 14" steering wheel would be fine.
Anything less than that I cant tell you, but down to about 12" diameter I would guess would still not be too firm, except for maybe a woman driver.
72 Roadrunner 400-4 Auto-3.23 Gear-Black Cruiser
71 Cuda 440-6 Tribute-Limelight-A833 Close Ratio-4 Sp-Pistol Grip-Dana 3.54 Powr Lok-Rally Dash-Shaker (Sold)
92 Dodge Stealth RT-Twin 15g Turbos-SAFC2 Tuned-Mystic Blue-5 Sp-AWD-Rear Wheel Steering-AutoX'r (Sold)
12 Dodge Charger SXT Plus Blacktop Package-3.6L-8 Sp-Leather-Nav (the wife's)

Multiple SRT's, Rams, Dakotas, Caravans and Neons

...the lines on the road just look like dots!....

Offline cudazappa

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Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #25 on: June 22, 2013 - 11:16:43 AM »
With the Stage 3, can you whip the steering wheel back and forth (left-right-left-right...).. repeatedly without "undesirable resistance".. such as running through a long set of pylons?

Yes you can Mitch.  I love the stage 3 in mine.   Any resistance you find will be from worn components.  I need some tie rods and since the stage three box they are much more noticeable with the stage 3 box than they were with the stock over assisted box.  Any other questions call me later tonight.
1971 Challenger - AutoX project
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Offline HEMROID

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #26 on: June 23, 2013 - 08:28:09 AM »
I sent Firm Feel an email to finalise what I wanted to order, hoping to get the following:

- PSB3.......$359; plus
- Steering Core Charge PSC........$175;
- Pot Connector Kit PK0.........$25;
- Fast Ratio Pitman Arm

Matt told me that they now only ship large sector boxes internationally due to a lack of small sector cores. I presume the large won't fit my 70 e body? I'm now a bit confused and very keen on getting my steering firmed up.
Matt
1970 Dodge Challenger R/T 440 Six Pack (clone)
2008 Lexus IS F

Offline cudazappa

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Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #27 on: June 23, 2013 - 08:43:13 AM »
A large sector box will fit your ebody.  You just need the corresponding pitman arm.  The large sector box is less prone to leaking, as I was told, and was used through 1989 so it is more common.  My FFI Stage 3 was built from a large sector core.
1971 Challenger - AutoX project
2015 Dart GT - Daily Driver

Offline HEMROID

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #28 on: June 23, 2013 - 08:47:38 AM »
Oh sweet, that's great news. For some reason I gathered that wasn't the case, I want a fast ratio pitman arm anyway so buying a new one is no problem.
Matt
1970 Dodge Challenger R/T 440 Six Pack (clone)
2008 Lexus IS F

Offline dodj

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Re: Firm Feel Rebuild?
« Reply #29 on: June 23, 2013 - 10:13:50 AM »
Oh sweet, that's great news. For some reason I gathered that wasn't the case, I want a fast ratio pitman arm anyway so buying a new one is no problem.
The fast ratio arms do interfere with certain brands of headers though. Make sure if you have headers, that they will clear.
Scott
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2007.5 3500 6.7 Cummins Diesel, Anarchy tuned.
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