my opinion... should be kept to my self.

Author Topic: my opinion... should be kept to my self.  (Read 4207 times)

Offline 70nos340 barracuda

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my opinion... should be kept to my self.
« on: July 24, 2006 - 07:08:50 PM »
hello all and i am sure i will get crap and everything else for writing this but to each his own! just my opinion! i keep seeing and hearing how nitrous is no good, it will blow u up, it's cheating, why not build it with the horsepower to begin with and u won't need it. i am so tired of this, 1 yes if your stupid with it it will get you! ,but if u build the motor with the right stuff, (and no not high dollar mine cost $800!) and don't go crazy with it it works, and very good. i am not sayin 500hp jets on a stock motor, but 100-150, with a good motor it will work!(good fuel,retard timing 2 deg. -50hp) i have used it alot and had 1 blow up but the motor was tired, my second was a stock rebuild with 11.5.1 forged pistons(i know u can't run that on pump gas, and u really can't on n.o.s. well i did for along time 9bottles with no prob.) six pack cam, stock heads, old torq. man. 650 holley old headers, msd ign. nothin fancy. it was what i had and it run very good.(7.24@98mph in the 8th at 5800 ft not corrected 90% no stall no slicks wish i had them no more $!)this was my high school car drove it everyday. and no it's not the fastest or nicest,but worked for what it was. and second n.o.s. is cheating? this is just dumb. 3rd build the hp first, well if i had the money to build what ever i want i would, but 500hp is 500hp if u build it or spray it. and to get 500 hp from the bottle is way cheaper. i know this is prob. going to ruffle some feathers, and thats ok my point was not to start a fight, just my opinion, it would be a boring world if everybody did the same thing! I LOVE N.O.S.!!!!!!!!!!!
« Last Edit: July 28, 2006 - 08:00:27 PM by 70nos340 barracuda »




Offline 4Cruizn

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2006 - 07:45:33 PM »
NOS works for me!  I don't use it but I used to go to Memphis, TN for the FAstest Street car Shootout and watch the NOS at work!  Some dammn fast cars there!!  Used to loved when they purged at the burnout box!   :bananasmi

Offline tactransman

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2006 - 08:04:50 PM »
I have it on my car , it is only cheating if you keep it a secret IMO.
Want to see some good action , put a NOS car against a NOS car.
It is a rush to feel and see later on video your car with a stock suspension and slicks put air under the front tires.
It went from 13.20's to 11.83 in the quarter
Motor has forged pistons and stock rods.
It hurts things when you go lean, so don't go lean. :thumbsup:


(By the way 70nos340 you notta a newbie no more) :thumbsup:
« Last Edit: July 25, 2006 - 07:49:05 AM by tactransman »
Terry-tactransman 
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Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline 70nos340 barracuda

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2006 - 08:16:29 PM »
sweet i didn't even notice! jr. member! thanks and a big 10-4 on the no lean! lots o fuel!... and i never hide it ,but when i did street race thats what they would say! now i got two little poopheads! and one on the way(pray boy this time!) so i don't race on the streets now and plus that was in idaho(3000 people and lots of roads in between the farms!)
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006 - 08:21:34 PM by 70nos340 barracuda »

Offline Chryco Psycho

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2006 - 08:31:18 PM »
there is no question NOS works , lots of people use it , I never will though , the costs over time will become more than a turbo or blower & either is easier on the engine internals , each to their own

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Offline moper

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2006 - 07:01:34 AM »
I've used it..a bunch. My favorite is the basic 175-250 plates. I like the "use it when you need it" part. It is more cost as it's used than a single expense form of boost like a turbo or supercharger. But for many, even with the initial cost of purcahse and install, one doesnt reach that same cost threshold as a cheaper blower system for a long time. I can honestly say, when I was driving a 340/4sp Cuda daily for 3 years, I used about 18 bottle s month, at $50/fill. The initial cost for the system, fuel regulater and various safety switches was about $500. So for $1400, my car went from passing emmisions and running pump gas daily, to running 12.30s with a stick, radials, and 3.23s. Off the system it was a mid 13s car. I'd take 1400 over 3 years much easier than $3-5K one time any day. Eventually tho, the cost factor evens out, and then the bottles cost more than a fixed mechanical boost setup. Boost is boost. You wont break anything more with NOS than a turbo or blower. But, you are directly in charge of the possibility of the tune being off, and having a problem. It's a "hands on" responsibility...lol. And, you have to know how it works, how it must be supported, and how it can go wrong. That same kit was removed after the cuda got totalled (stupid teenagers..not me...lol), and I installed it on my replacement car. A '71 4dr Newport, with the 250hp 383 2bbl. With a mild (R/V) MP cam,, and duals off the log manifolds, plus a 383 Magnum intake and carb, I was beating 5.0 mustangs, and Buick T types on the highway (stock form..lol) with 4 passengers in my car. Anything that can push a C body into the mid 13s with a 383 and 3.55s at the push of a button cant be bad. And cheating is only what you dont tell. Narrow minds call NOS cheating, but really, true cheating involves a ton more than just a chemical booster...lol.

Offline 70nos340 barracuda

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2006 - 04:13:31 PM »
thanks and i agree! i dropped asecond and a half in the 8th! with 150hp, plate.

Offline torredcuda

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2006 - 06:25:35 PM »
Nos,turbos and superchargers are all power adders but the only thing about NOS is it isn`t there all the time,only when you hit the button and that only lasts so long.Great for drag racing or quick blasts but for everyday street driving I`d rather just have a nice strong carburated engine anytime I put my foot in it.I run my car right off the street with full exhaust and BFG`s and have run 13.2`s-3`s.Next spring I`ll have a stroker smallblock with 425-450hp and be well into the 12`s.If I see you on the street you better have your bottle on!  :poopoke:  :bigsmile:
Jeff
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70 roadrunner 383/auto  In-Violet
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Offline Chryco Psycho

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2006 - 11:34:19 PM »
the other thing with NOS is that it is harder on the crank... really , I mean 1 cylinder makes approx 50 hp for example & the next cylinder suddenly has NOS & makes 15or more HP instantly , where a blower or turbo builds gradually & consistantly & on exhasut stroke where a con rod will generally fail with the intake valve open before TDC will offer some pressure to cushion the rod stretch at tdc as well

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Offline moper

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2006 - 06:50:23 AM »
Well, it doesnt happen that fast, really. In terms of crank stress, you look to bob weights and piston speeds much more than rotational (torsional) stress from a sudden increase in force applied. At an engine speed of say, 3K rpm, the pressure exerted from one piston on one power stroke lasts for less than 90°. Doing some quickie and probably not 100 perfect math...piston speed on a 340 is 27'/sec at 3000rpm. The intake mix will be roughly 1/3 the speed of sound (on a good set of heads), which is about 370'/sec. I cant see a way the crank would be "hit" the way you describe if you opened a solenoid and the chemicals went into the intake tract. Even at lower rpm, the pistons just arent moving that fast. If it can deal with boost levels and torsional stress from a belt driven blower of any kind, it can deal with the "hit" of an NOS kit. Turbos are definately the softest of the bunch, both in terms of no torsional stress from belts, and progressive boost curves. I dont really follow the "rod failure/cushion" part tho. On a blower/turbo boosted engine, if you open the intake valve too soon, the boost is working against the piston before it passes TDC, and a bit of boost is "bled off" out the still-open exh valve from overlap. The rods do flex a small amount at the directional change, like less than .002-.003" at 6500 for a typical steel rod. If the rod bolts stretch at all, you've got a problem. is that what you mean?

Offline Follicly Challenged

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2006 - 09:29:07 AM »
Just my opinion, no wars wanted.

Depending upon rod length to stroke ratio, the first damaging harmonics(minor), on a 50 % (standard) balance job, with no overbalance condition, occurs a 3300-3500 rpm, second and more severe(major) phasing @ ~ 6800. This is a product of a steel crank "winding & un-winding" down it length, while spinning in the Block, and the staggered counterweight location(not perfect).

When related to "torsional stress" on the crank from a "relatively" abrupt increase in cylinder pressure,(nitrous), because the piston moves farther in the bore in the first 90 degrees of crank rotation from TDC, than in the second 90 degrees to BDC, due to main placement, damaging harmonics, or increased torsional stress on the crank would be more severe proportionally to the longer rod ratio engines, as opposed to the "shorter stuff's" ability to get the piston "outa the way" quicker,(dwell time). That said, the longer stuff will extract more from the burn(for lack of a better term), with the higher dwell time.

Just my opinion, but the very characteristics of our beloved mopars, that make 'em great revvers dimensionally in the bottom end,(other than the heavy bobweights), also make 'em more susceptible to cracked cranks under 'abrupt" nitrous loads, as opposed to boost increase(slower).

I think the manufacturers, generally, have recognized this also, with the evolution of the newer engines over the last 30 yrs going to the more common lower ratios and cast cranks(cheaper), even accepting increased cylinder wear as "OK" for a timed useable lifespan. "planned obsolescence" really.
(4.6 & 5.4 modular fords being more exceptions than the norm by "packing" the crank counterweight lenth together closer)

Like I said, no wars wanted, I'm an old Fart !  just my opinion.

Offline moper

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2006 - 01:02:11 PM »
FC, lol..no wars wanted here either. I'd like to find a place to have an intelligent debate on various Mopar tech things...I have yet to find it, except on speedtalk, and thats not mopar special. All opinions welcomed! Just no name calling, my wife takes care of that enough for the rest of the world.
 In terms of harmonics, the way I understand it, it has to do with the placement of the throws, and the overall length, counterweight placement, and rod/stroke. Because it's a "V" 8, you cant get the oposing forces even, and you cant even get it on the same 1/2 of the crank, and the counterweight is not reciprocating, so it's only a partial counter force. I know 6 cylinder GMCs have a harmonic bad spot in the 6300 range, because the crank is so long, the rods are long, and the counterweights are 2.5' apart on it. Plus, the firing is every 120° instead of 90. The upside is, they have 6 main caps. From what I've seen, the Mopar V8s (at least the big blocks) suffer much more from the mains moving under the crank's flex then the crank cracking from "twist". Maybe that extra flex is from the long rods and it's extra dwell at TDC? I still think a centrifical blower might be easier, but if you've tried to turn a P1SC by hand, you'll see how bad the belt load is on a crank at speed. The Roots type blower and NO2 IMO are about equal in terms of stress, the turbos are much easier on it. I'll have to snoop around more on the subject...lol.

Offline PistolGrip440-6

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2006 - 04:27:34 PM »
As long as your not trying to say your car is faster than someone elses when you have NOS and they dont, then its not cheating. I dont really think its right to put a NOS equiped car against a non equiped car because the non equipped car owner had to work much harder to make his power.

Offline dimples

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2006 - 05:54:37 PM »
I like NOS.   :bigsmile:

As long as your engine is built for it, and you have enough fuel pouring to it, you are good, IMO.

I also like it because it is fun to watch the NOS guys blow pieces out of the bottom of the motor, great for spectating!
As far as hard on things, it isn't any different than a blower, or turbo, I would 'nt think, other than it is WAY more suseptable to blowing your engine if something with the fuel delivery DOES go wrong.

Offline Challenger6pak

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Re: my opinion...but i am just a newbie!!!!!!
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2006 - 06:52:35 PM »
I've always liked NOS.  I like NOS more and more with gas prices the way they are.  You can have mileage and performance at the same time.
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