I just don't know where to start - engines...

[ViperMan]

Hey all,

There are 121 pages of topics in this forum thread, and I scanned the first few to see if someone already asked this.  It's too vague to search for...

I just posted in the newbie thread about my '73 Barracuda.  She's got a 318 possibly from the 80's.  It's not the original, at least as I've been told.  Now yes, I know I can get up into it and find out exactly when it was built, and I just flat haven't had time to.  Actually, it's been too flippin' cold.

I'm trying to start planning ahead.  I want to rebuild a motor - a real motor.  At WyoTech I rebuilt a Honda 4 cylinder...  'Nough Said.  I need a real challenge now, and I want to do it from scratch, on my own.

Some people say rebuild the 318 - you can make a lot of power out of them.  Others recommend a 383 - easy to find parts and easy to make power.  I'm torn with finding a 340 to kinda rebuild what my dad's car had, or just go balls-to-the-wall 440.  I'm also trying to keep in mind fuel-consumption (I mean I know that's not the point with these cars, but you at least have to keep it into consideration when gas hits $10 a gallon.)  I must admit I've considered the possibility of being the first to retrofit a Mopar with a Hydrogen Fuel Cell engine.

Anyways, I want 400+ hp, but still a street cruiser.  Not looking for 1/4 mile times, not looking for strip or street racing.  Just want something that sounds gorgeous and at least stays atop these modern GTO's, 'Stangs and possibly Camaro's.

So where should I start?  I need to pick a block (with a year range as I realize there's a difference from decade to decade,) and heads.  I can handle it from there.

Jeff

[wart1de]

A nice 340 or 360 would best suit your needs. It costs the same to build those as it does a 318 and at the end of the day your car will be worth slightly more.

Exactly how you build it will depend on your budget. You can make 400hp with ported cheap 308 heads and basic bottom end. Chryco here will be able to help you with the heads.  Of course you can go more exotic with alloy heads, stroke it out to 408+ and maybe add fuel injection but it's all about how much you want to spend.

As long as you can get some sort of traction, a genuine 400hp small block Cuda should beat 90% of cars you are likely to come across on the street.

[MEK-Dangerfield]

This is a toughie. I'm just thinking what blocks would be cheapest to get right now. Definitely the 318, then I would say the 383, 360, and 400. To get more than 400HP, you will still need to do some major upgrades. If you want 400+ HP, I would think the gas mileage would NOT be good with any block.


   Mike

[SilverChally]

Id go 340 or 360, stay sb to keep the trans and mounts, exhaust, etc... but dont put money into a 318, when a bigger motor will make more power, its not the original motor anyways.

[ViperMan]

What about ease in finding parts?  Is it easier to find 340 parts?  383 parts?  I don't want to deal with the hassle of aluminum heads, so I'm going to try to find a bare block and heads so that I can pick all my other parts - crank, mains, cam, lifters, rollers, pushrods, valves, pistons, rods, etc...

And lemme clarify - fuel consumption is nowhere on my priority list.  It's just something to keep in the back of my mind.

I really liked the buildup I saw in the other engines thread about the 340/418...  I think that's what it said.  I'm still browsing around.

So, besides ebay and swap meets, anyone know of any good online sources for old blocks/heads?

[Confederate Cuda]

Once you decide what you want, let me know and I will try to find you one local. I know a few guys who have some 340 stuff sitting around.

[Street_Challenged73]

If you wanted to stay era correct, a 340 would be the best engine to build going that route.  The advantage of going to a 360, though not offered in '73, is that they're still cheap to come by and can produce power as easily as a 340 can.  I just got word of a built 340 in the Chicago area for $4,700, which is a great price considering the guy had a racing shop put over $6,000 into it. (conservatively rated at 500-550hp)

[Chryco Psycho]

the bIG BLOCKS SEEM TO HAVE MORE HEAD CHOICES aarg, & make relaible HP & can offer good economy as they do not have to work hard to move a relative light E body  But it is easier to fit a small block in & they is less part to change & there is nothing wrong with small blocks , any engine wil cost virtually the same $$ to build

[Dave-R]

You will find it hard to find a decent compression off the shelf piston for a 383.

Also remember. Engines make power from the amount of fuel they burn minus losses due to friction etc etc.

So a 400hp engine will get about the same mileage no matter what its size.

It will be much easier to fit a 340 or 360 in there. Plus your existing transmission will cope if rebuilt/upgraded with the right bits.

[Jacksboys]

Since you are not looking for a 1/4 racer, my choice would be a 360 because it would be easier to install.  Also on a long trip, you will get better mpg than a big block if it is geared the same.  Plus with the stroker kits now available, you can get the torque of a bigblock with the size and weight of a small block.  The less weight with the added torque would keep most of modern cars guessing you had a bigblock.

The advantage if a 440 is the added torque, which means you can run more of a highway gear and still be just as fast as a hot small block.  The other advantage is the look on the person's face when you say, "It's a 440."  The 440 should also be easier to spin the tires if you want to show off.  The downside is the added weight, but if you keep most of it aluminum, then you should be able to get it down close to that of a small block.

It really just depends on how you want your car to look, sound, and spin tires 

Good Luck  

[moper]

Always start with the first thing to consider, and what will be the last thing that limits you. Wahat is the budget for the entire driveline? You can get your goals from every engien mentionned in one form or another. What can you afford to do? Small block you have stuf. Big block you will need to update teh transmission, and posibly rear axle depending on what you have now. To decide, list everything you have on the car now, enginemods, transmission, rear axle type and gearing, suspension, brakes, and then what you can honestly afford to sepnd. That is a solid dollar figure. Not a "I have some now, and I'll have more later." Set a plan in motion based on reality, and then stick to it, and you'll be successful.

[ViperMan]

Thanks all,

I'm finally getting the car back up in the air tomorrow at my store to get some stampings off the block, trans, and rear.

I'm pretty sure it's a 940 trans with a standard, plain-jane rear end.

I intend on finding a 727 trans (forgive me if my numbers are a digit-or-two off) but I don't really want to "beef it up."  I work with a mopar nut - he started talking about honing out the trans to compensate for a larger, stronger planetary set, etc.   I don't really think I want to get that involved.  I'll definitely need to replace the rear end with someone a little bulkier and with some sort of locking action.

My coworker suggest a big-block because of the torque advantage, and because of their reduced stroke, allowing faster spin-up.  Plus I can probably get the same amount of power from a modestly built 383 as I can from a heavily built 340.

I think I'm going to set my goals at about 400hp for now, and less than $5,000 for the engine.  (I'm going to aim for $4,000)  I can't begin to guestimate a cost for the transmission - I have experience in rebuilding transmissions, but not "modifying" them (as mentioned above.)  So maybe I can find a used 727 that then I can rebuild on my leisure with a good set of aftermarket, possibly stronger parts.  As far as the rear end, my coworker warned me to expect prices exceeding $4,000 for something from a reputable, national provider (names of popular companies are currently eluding me...)

Plus I seem to find 383's everywhere...  They don't seem to be as popular as 340's, which can make prices a little cheaper if nothing else.

Keep the advice coming - I'm absorbing every bit.  Thanks again.

Jeff

[MEK-Dangerfield]

Jeff,
  It sounds like you have your head on straight here.  A 383 with modest tweaks should get you close to 400 HP easy. A 727 tranny will handle that fine. I don't see why the Mopar 8 3/4" sure-grip rear wouldn't work for you.  I'll let others advise you more.

  Mike

[Jacksboys]

Jeff,
  It sounds like you have your head on straight here.  A 383 with modest tweaks should get you close to 400 HP easy. A 727 tranny will handle that fine. I don't see why the Mopar 8 3/4" sure-grip rear wouldn't work for you.  I'll let others advise you more.

  Mike

If you go with a 383, then a stock rebuilt 727 will be able to handle 400hp without any trouble.  Also unless you have a 7 1/4 rear, then I would not worry about getting anything bigger.  I have an 8 3/4 in my 70 Dart race car with a 440 under the hood.  It has run a best of 11.58 at 115mph and the rearend has not had a bit of trouble.

Good luck with your decision   

[Dave-R]

If you want a 727 then go for a big block because the smallblock version of the 727 is getting hard to find.

I highly reccommend TCS Products for your transmission parts. They are in BC Canada. www.tcsproducts.com
Speak to Graham Shortreed (graham@tcsproducts.com) as he owns an E-body.