Going to be getting 17" wheels, what do you think of these rims?

[TrakHor]

What good are all these big brakes that everyone is putting on if all they are gonna do is lock up and flat spot the $300 each tires?

I really want to know, I'm not being sarcastic this time.  Without ABS, what good are all the upgrades people are putting on?

Heat disapation. Small brakes have to work harder therefore they create more heat.
Also, some of the best tires for 17" rims are less than 150 per tire for typical sizes. On my current track day car I have a set of 88 dollar Sumitomo's in size 275/40-17. The grip on these tires is exceptional! My personal recommendation would be something like a Falken Azenis RT 615 or Kumho MX. Both are in the 150 dollar range for sizes that IMO would look good on a Challenger or Cuda.

This thread:

http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=31623.0

Has pictures of a beautiful 71 Cuda with the KMC Hot Wheels sixty-eights.  I thought seriously about the black sixty-eights, but it didn't seem like you could get them with a deep dish.

Travis
72 Cuda

You beat me to it, I was looking at that thread just the other day. BTW tires.com has those in 17x9 with 0mm offset(approx 5" backspacinng) and a black center. That is about as deep of a dish as you can get away with on a Chally.
Jason

[Dray]

360Cuda, I sent off an email to Baer asking them about the point you made.  I will post the response when I get it.

NZ, yeah, I am starting to think maybe 13" rotors may be overkill.  I will have to see what Baer responds with to my post.

Travis72, thanx, I searched this site head to toe and still didn't find that post.  That definitely lets me know what they would look like.

ArticCuda, do you have any pics of the rims on a e-body?

TrakHor, Good to know about tire cost, especially since I will have a lot of tire roasting to do for all my friends when the Chally is back on the road.

Here are a couple pics of some cars with the salt flat rims.  The more I look at them, the less I like them.  This is impossible haha.

[HP2]

The intersting thing to me is that MOST classic car owners are not driving their cars hard enough to need anything bigger than 10" rotors. Mopar offers a 10.87 and an 11.75 that are actually very good at stopping cars. I also think that a lot of owners never consider the airflow necessary to get brakes to stay efficient with heavy use, nor do they consider that pad compound is paramount to the parameters the brakes will operate best at. Road race your stock rallye wheeled car using off the shelf, generic parts store pads and you are going to experience severe fade. Run that same car with a more open wheel, brake ducting, and ceramic pads and you will be able to haul it down from triple digit speed repeatedly without much drama.

I see the whole 4 wheel 13"+ rotor thing the same way I see coil over suspension conversions. Sure they are nice, but they are overkill. They are functional "bling" that most drivers will never be able to fully utilize but they are impressive at the pro parking garage and the stop light derby.

On the wheel and tire topic, yes, 17" tires are available in a plethora of choices at a mulitude of prices. Heck, if you don't mind using the spacers, you can get 17" Mustang wheels for around $150 with matching $150 tires and have a complete set up for around $1500. Not bad. The choices in 17" wheels is HUGE and you can find any kind of wheel your heart desires.

Conversly, even plain jane 15" BFG tires are S speed rate to SUSTAINED 112 mph driving, which most of us never do. If you really want serious 15" performance tires they are still out there and available, they just aren't cheap anymore. Expect to spend $200-350 per tire for V or Z rated ultra performance 15" skins that stick like glue.

[GoodysGotaCuda]

i personally am not too big of a fan of big chrome wheels on muscle cars. I just dont think they go, painted/powdercoated is a whole different ball game as far as big rims go. Ill just put in my 2cents of no fully chrome/polished big wheels..however there are very few i do like that way 


horrible picture, but id like to do something like this to my car 17/18   

[willhaven]

I agree with Goody. The larger the wheel, the less likely it should be chrome (unless you reaaaally love chrome). Painted, powder coated or anodized is the way to go if you want the performance of the large wheel while minimizing the apparent size of the wheel visually.

[TrakHor]

The intersting thing to me is that MOST classic car owners are not driving their cars hard enough to need anything bigger than 10" rotors. Mopar offers a 10.87 and an 11.75 that are actually very good at stopping cars. I also think that a lot of owners never consider the airflow necessary to get brakes to stay efficient with heavy use, nor do they consider that pad compound is paramount to the parameters the brakes will operate best at. Road race your stock rallye wheeled car using off the shelf, generic parts store pads and you are going to experience severe fade. Run that same car with a more open wheel, brake ducting, and ceramic pads and you will be able to haul it down from triple digit speed repeatedly without much drama.

I see the whole 4 wheel 13"+ rotor thing the same way I see coil over suspension conversions. Sure they are nice, but they are overkill. They are functional "bling" that most drivers will never be able to fully utilize but they are impressive at the pro parking garage and the stop light derby.

On the wheel and tire topic, yes, 17" tires are available in a plethora of choices at a mulitude of prices. Heck, if you don't mind using the spacers, you can get 17" Mustang wheels for around $150 with matching $150 tires and have a complete set up for around $1500. Not bad. The choices in 17" wheels is HUGE and you can find any kind of wheel your heart desires.

Conversly, even plain jane 15" BFG tires are S speed rate to SUSTAINED 112 mph driving, which most of us never do. If you really want serious 15" performance tires they are still out there and available, they just aren't cheap anymore. Expect to spend $200-350 per tire for V or Z rated ultra performance 15" skins that stick like glue.

Good point HP2 for the average muscle car owner off the shelf parts are more than adequate.  If you never plan on putting your car through it's paces, then the bigger brakes are problably more eye wash than anything else. Just curious if you have any insight on the V or Z rated 15" tires. I know Avon makes them in a radial at about the prices you quoted, but are there any others?

I went back and forth on my decision of 15"s vs 17"s. The decison to go with 17"s was tire availability and price. The KMC 68 is an affordable wheel that's offered in the proper offset and is realitively light at 19 lbs. My car will be a dedicated road course car, I don't even know if I'll tag and insure it. So good affordable tires and brakes are required for me. I wanted 15"s for a vintage road racer look, but with bias race tires in the 180+ range for 15" I just couldn't justify it. I know for a fact that BFG's won't cut it on a road course and being S rating won't cut it either.
Jason

[Bearcuda]

I did a couple of photoshops for ya to see them on your car. Well, here's one at least. Apparently I didn't convert the other two to correct file format. I'll have to do that tonight.

[HP2]

TrakHor, there are also Goodyear, Hoosier, McCreary, and Towel City who make sticky 15" tires. Only problem with these are that you have to find someone in their dealer network to get them. Best bet is usually oval track suppliers. Since these are typically race tires, their grip and ratings support that first, d.o.t. compliance is usually secondary. Check here for some selections; http://www.rogerkrausracing.com/

One nice thing about 17" wheels is that some many people are buying them for their SUV these days that tire manufacturers are offering some 45 and 40 series tires in some pretty substantial widths that look really good on a muscle car without making the proportions look out of wack like a 30 series, rubber band looking tire would. While some of these are kind of tall at around 28 inches, that is no taller than a 275/60x15 that a lot of people run.

[TrakHor]

TrakHor, there are also Goodyear, Hoosier, McCreary, and Towel City who make sticky 15" tires. Only problem with these are that you have to find someone in their dealer network to get them. Best bet is usually oval track suppliers. Since these are typically race tires, their grip and ratings support that first, d.o.t. compliance is usually secondary. Check here for some selections; http://www.rogerkrausracing.com/

One nice thing about 17" wheels is that some many people are buying them for their SUV these days that tire manufacturers are offering some 45 and 40 series tires in some pretty substantial widths that look really good on a muscle car without making the proportions look out of wack like a 30 series, rubber band looking tire would. While some of these are kind of tall at around 28 inches, that is no taller than a 275/60x15 that a lot of people run.

Yeah I've checked out roger kraus. He's very helpful and friendly. I even have Sascosports.com just 45 minutes away. Those tires are too expensiver for thier wear rate for my budget.

Sorry to hijack your thread Dray....I can only give one true bit of advice. Get what YOU want and something you will be happy with.
Jason

[Carlwalski]

Man, HP2 you sure know your stuff mate (& Trakhor).

I have one slight point though, I like to think I use my cars "close" to their full potential, not fully as doing that kind of driving on the street is obviously dangerous and bloody stupid and I haven't been out on a track yet but it's a future plan/goal. One thing on the brakes, I mentioned earlier that IMO the 11" SSBC style brakes are about all you need for the streets, anything else I thought was overkill, so I agree with you on that point.

But, brakes and cars are not all about performance, feel is also a driving experience. Having a nice firm pedal to ease into on the straight before taking a nice corner at slow/moderate/fast speeds is a pleasure & enhances the driving experience compared to spaghetti stock brakes etc.

[HP2]

Thanks NZ. I'd like to think the last 30 years of my life amounted to more than greasy hands, bloody knuckles and blown paychecks...and I agree, driver feel is a very large part of the equation.

For the record, I'm not opposed to 17" wheels and tires and big brakes. I'm just pretty practical about their use because in my situation to get the wheels I want with the appropriate rubber to match is going to run me $3000 and the brakes would be another grand on top of that. That would cover a pretty fair amount of body and interior work that my car needs worse than new wheels, tires, and brakes. I can make my 15"s and stock brakes work pretty dang good for what I need for the short term.

But, some folks out there have plenty of money and time for toys. Jason is right, getting what you like and what you want to see on your car is ultimatly the correct answer regardless of what any of us say.

Tony

[Bullitt-]

But, brakes and cars are not all about performance, feel is also a driving experience. Having a nice firm pedal to ease into on the straight before taking a nice corner at slow/moderate/fast speeds is a pleasure & enhances the driving experience compared to spaghetti stock brakes etc.

I'm not disagreeing with anything you guys are saying here, as a matter of fact I think most of this is right-on, but I can't help but think of some of you yougers that have never had the pleasure of taking a full size 60's 4,000lb+ land yacht with drum brakes & 78 series bias ply tires thru its paces. All the whining about overpowered steering, needing brake upgrades & spending thousands trying to finda a way to handle with the ricers makes me laugh....You don't known how good you've already got it.        Any of you other oldsters feel the same way?

[willhaven]

There's no reason you can't have the best of both worlds: vintage style with modern performance.

Nostalgia is a strong force. New and improved often translates to "what the hell did they do to my _____" for seasoned vets.

[Travis72]

Dray,

I agree that rim selection is tough.  I've spent a LONG time trying to figure out what rims I want to run on my Cuda.  A lot of comes down to what you can afford though..... for example, some of the rims I really liked where in the $2500 for 4 range.  For top of the line 3 piece forged rims (i.e. light weight) you can pay like $1000 per rim!!   

So if you're looking for cheap options, the cheapest you can get for 17" rims are the Mustang rims (either Cobra, FR500, or Bullitt).  If you can get over the fact that they are Mustang rims, they can be had pretty cheap all over eBay in any color you want (chrome, black, grey, white, etc.).  Just make sure you get the proper offset (backspacing) that you need since a lot of the rims have like 6" of backspacing.  Also, you might have to open up the center slightly to clear the Mopar hub.

Anyway, attached is a Photoshop chop of a black Bullitt rim on a Cuda (not my car, just a photo I used) which is a pretty classic looking choice.   I had a guy do a bunch of Photoshop chops for me to help with rim selection, since I suck at Photoshop, and it's still tough for me to decide.

Also, the American Racing Torque Thrust II's are a classic option and look great.  They are kind of played out since it seems like every first gen Camaro in the world has them, but I haven't seen too many Mopars with them.  I bought a beat up used pair cheap to allow me to get my car back on the ground so I can push it around the garage (needed 17's to clear the brakes).  So also attached is a picture of the Torque Thrusts on my Cuda (sorry no fenders but you get the idea).

Travis
72 Cuda

[chevyconvert]

back to the original question...salt flats look good on their own, but not on the cars.
Love the sixty eights!