Author Topic: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???  (Read 3556 times)

Offline Jacksboys

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New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« on: July 04, 2007 - 01:22:22 AM »
Hey NZ440R/T
Have you seen this?

I came accross an interesting site that is based out of New Zealand:  www.waterpoweredcar.com/nz.html

Can an engine run on water?   :clueless:
You can build it yourself?   :clueless:

Any truth to this? 
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Offline Carlwalski

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2007 - 03:13:45 AM »


LOL! Not sure mate, this is the first I've heard about it. :lol2: Many crazy Kiwis doing weird things from their sheds......
Burt Munroe is just one of many Kiwis. ;) Kiwi ingenuity. Sounds interesting indeed. Good idea. :)
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Offline Pistol Gripper

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2007 - 04:29:02 AM »
I call B.S. on this one.  He might get the patent, doesn't mean it works, just that the patent office granted another patent.  Anyone want to bet that he'll start looking for investment money, perpetually be " a month or so away from releasing the goods " and eventually claim conspiracy shut him down ?

I'm willing to put up money that this turns out to be scam, any takers ?

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Offline 6packCuda

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2007 - 07:03:52 AM »
Here's a story I came across a couple days ago.

« Last Edit: July 04, 2007 - 07:06:07 AM by 6packCuda »
Dave

Offline merlin969

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2007 - 08:16:24 AM »
It's definitely possible, it goes something like this.  The water is split by electrolysis into hydrogen and oxygen.  The two are then burned for combustion/power and the exhaust is steam.  Of course it takes electricity usually in the form of batteries for the electrolysis so its partially electric.  I'm no expert but if I remember correctly thats basically how it works.  Hope this helps
« Last Edit: July 04, 2007 - 08:22:27 AM by merlin969 »
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Offline 71bigblock

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2007 - 08:26:16 AM »
It's definitely possible, it goes something like this.  The water is split by electrolysis into hydrogen and oxygen.  The two are then burned for combustion/power and the exhaust is steam.  Of course it takes electricity usually in the form of batteries for the electrolysis so its partially electric.  I'm no expert but if I remember correctly thats basically how it works.  Hope this helps

You are correct!

;) Kiwi ingenuity. Sounds interesting indeed. Good idea. :)

Hey, I watched a movie on that guy!  Great movie, even if it is a ways off from what happened.   :2thumbs:

Offline jeryst

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2007 - 10:23:11 AM »
It's definitely possible, it goes something like this.  The water is split by electrolysis into hydrogen and oxygen.  The two are then burned for combustion/power and the exhaust is steam.  Of course it takes electricity usually in the form of batteries for the electrolysis so its partially electric.  I'm no expert but if I remember correctly thats basically how it works.  Hope this helps

This is correct, but it is a continuous process, meaning that the water would continuously have to be subjected to electrolysis to provide hydrogen and oxygen. He is obviously not claiming that. He is claiming that he is somehow altering the chemical structure of water.

I guess I would just have to keep an open mind. Most world-changing inventions have come from backyard inventors, not major institutions (internal combustion motor, cars, airplanes, PC's, etc). He is right about what he says in the interview, that formal training sometimes prevents people from discovering something new because they are taught that certain things are not possible. The one thing that comes to mind, is that engineers can prove that it is impossible for a bee to fly. Good thing the bees have never had formal engineering training, or they would just walk everywhere. Many discoveries have come from people without formal training in certain areas, because they are not limited buy their knowledge.

If it's a scam, well, so be it. But if it's real, imagine the possibilities. Fill your Hemi-Cuda up from the stream out back, and BURN RUBBER ALL DAY LONG!

Offline merlin969

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2007 - 10:53:36 AM »
This is correct, but it is a continuous process, meaning that the water would continuously have to be subjected to electrolysis to provide hydrogen and oxygen. He is obviously not claiming that. He is claiming that he is somehow altering the chemical structure of water.

I guess I would just have to keep an open mind. Most world-changing inventions have come from backyard inventors, not major institutions (internal combustion motor, cars, airplanes, PC's, etc). He is right about what he says in the interview, that formal training sometimes prevents people from discovering something new because they are taught that certain things are not possible. The one thing that comes to mind, is that engineers can prove that it is impossible for a bee to fly. Good thing the bees have never had formal engineering training, or they would just walk everywhere. Many discoveries have come from people without formal training in certain areas, because they are not limited buy their knowledge.

If it's a scam, well, so be it. But if it's real, imagine the possibilities. Fill your Hemi-Cuda up from the stream out back, and BURN RUBBER ALL DAY LONG!

I answered the question posed by the initial poster which was "Can an engine run on water?"
but thanks for your input.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2007 - 01:07:09 PM by merlin969 »
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Offline matt63

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #8 on: July 04, 2007 - 11:09:19 AM »
I didn't read the whole page so I hope I haven't missed the boat here but... I think the main issue is that the energy required to release the hydrogen is greater than the energy derived from burning the hydrogen.  There have been other claims like this.  It's kind of like perpetual motion.  It does make more sense if the electricity is free/cheap like hydropower.  If you could generate electricity from regenerative braking and use that it might make sense also although it is another form of what already exists in today's hybrid cars.  If you have to burn coal or natural gas then it does not.
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Offline JRoss22

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2007 - 11:38:23 AM »
When I was working at Honda I found out that next year they are going to start production on a hydrogen car called the FCX. http://automobiles.honda.com/future-cars/index.asp?ModelStart=fcx
Its not as far off as you think it would be with this technology.

Offline Autophile

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #10 on: July 04, 2007 - 02:38:58 PM »
The problem here is that the internal energy level of the fuel (water) is the same as the combustion product (water). So, at best, assuming that the energy for the splitter is 100% efficient and is supplied by the car itself, there is a zero net gain. In actuality, there will be unrecoverable energy losses from the splitting and rejoining processes. Therefore, it is impossible to power a car under this technology (after any externally supplied splitter energy source has been depleted).
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Offline Lunchbox

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #11 on: July 04, 2007 - 03:02:33 PM »
Another problem with a set up like this is that the device that splits the water molecules won't be able to split them fast enough for cusumption the car needs. Which leads to the big problem about hydorgen in the first place, the easiest way to make hydrogen is to burn fossil fuels.

The most effiecent engine (gasoline, Deseil, hydrogen, etc) out there runs at something like 55% efficency. The rest is energy lost to the enviroment in the form of heat.

Offline jeryst

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #12 on: July 04, 2007 - 03:08:43 PM »
The problem here is that the internal energy level of the fuel (water) is the same as the combustion product (water). So, at best, assuming that the energy for the splitter is 100% efficient and is supplied by the car itself, there is a zero net gain. In actuality, there will be unrecoverable energy losses from the splitting and rejoining processes. Therefore, it is impossible to power a car under this technology (after any externally supplied splitter energy source has been depleted).

You are assuming that everything is equal. Suppose the process takes in a quart of water and then yields energy plus a cup of water as a byproduct. Wouldn't the difference be the energy supplied by the other 3 cups of water that got used up in the process?

Offline matt63

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2007 - 03:24:37 PM »
You are assuming that everything is equal. Suppose the process takes in a quart of water and then yields energy plus a cup of water as a byproduct. Wouldn't the difference be the energy supplied by the other 3 cups of water that got used up in the process?
Don't know.  It takes energy to convert energy types so there is the net loss in energy.  I'm also a big skeptic so I'll believe it when I see it (not on YouTube). :lol:
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Offline Jacksboys

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Re: New Zealanders: Water powered engines???
« Reply #14 on: July 04, 2007 - 03:27:37 PM »
I found this link from the other site.  It talks about a Hydrogen Booster, which can allow your auto to get better mpg.
http://www.waterpoweredcar.com/hydrobooster.html

Interesting to say the least.

And another link:
http://www.waterpoweredcar.com/simplebooster.html

Interesting Quote:  "It's not a atomic separator/fuel cell, it's just a battery."
« Last Edit: July 04, 2007 - 03:31:29 PM by jacksboys »
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Success is the maximum utilization of the ability that you have. - Zig Ziglar