Author Topic: THE RETURN OF...THE guy who knows nothing about cars... 1973 Challenger Project  (Read 38344 times)

Offline Street_Challenged73

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Grasshopper, actually my '73 had a vinyl top and is all factory in that area.  Here's a photo of what mine looks like.  I'll see if I can find one with a better angle. :thumbsup:
EDIT: Here are a couple more photos showing that area better.  I'd hate for you to put all that work into the car and realize the quarters look a little out of place compared to what they should be. :2thumbs:
« Last Edit: January 04, 2008 - 11:17:14 AM by Street_Challenged73 »
1973 Dodge Challenger......................The ongoing project. (00/----\00)
1991 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo....The sunny day cruiser (RTBoost)
1990 Toyota Celica GT Liftback...........The new daily & winter driver.
All-American Muscle: 'Cudas and Challengers...Still the Elite and always will be.

                                                                                             
                 
Street_Challenged73 from Wisconsin




Offline Kapteenikosmos

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Ok, thanks that was how I thought that it should look. The transition is almost smooth as farmboy said. There is only very light "ditch" where the "imaginary" body line goes. I got the passenger side to look great with just sheet metal when I repaired that area but I messed up something on the drivers side (mine goes way too deep near the quarterwindow) and noticed it bit too late and I decided that I will correct the problem with lead instead of hacking it up again.
Ville

1967 six banger Mustang
1973 Challenger (under restoration)
1997 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC (daily driver)

Offline BruteForce

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  • '72 Dodge Challenger 340 5spd
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So far I have only found the manuals on CD.  Does anyone here use the CD's?  I'm more old school in this regard and prefer books.

I have the manual on CD. I like it that way, I just view it on my screen and then print off a page or two to use in the garage, and don't worry about ruining those pages. I wish I could get on CD all the back issues of the mopar magazines.

The mopar manuals are nice because they are just .jpg's of the paper manuals. There's a viewer that comes with it, but just ignore that, use the regular Windows file viewers.

This is in stark contrast to the Ford shop manual I bought on CD, which comes encrypted and cannot be read without their viewer - and their viewer crashes and hangs regularly. It's awful and unusable.

Offline Grasshopper

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Ok.  Almost all the prep work has been completed now on the body and the body of the car should be completely painted by the end of this week.  We'll be attending to the small pieces seperately and will try to compeltely finish phase 1 (all paint and body) by this weekend.

The floors and interior has been painted in a rust proof paint.  Just started painting the inside of the doors which will the same color and the lower part of the car.  We want to finish the doors today.  The engine bay just got its first coat of paint.  Hard to see the true color of the paint right now but we should have it popping by end of week.  The lines in the rear panel mentioned above have been smoothed out.  I need to keep some of the line because of the paint scheme.

So here is the car as it stands right now.  Enjoy and post any comments or questions.  Thanks for all for posting.

Offline Grasshopper

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More pics..

Offline FJ5_440

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Wow, you are moving right along!  What color is the engine going to be?  (please don't say Ford Blue)
** Shane **

Offline Grasshopper

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Wow, you are moving right along!  What color is the engine going to be?  (please don't say Ford Blue)

Thank you.

Engine - Ok....I'm not THAT new...haha!

If I get that far, the engine block will be painted red.  Would like orange but it won't fit with the color scheme of the car.  I'm trying to make the car flow as best as I can with the budget I have.

After each phase I am going to see if I want to keep going.  To keep it simple in my mind, I broke the car into 4 phases and have a budget for each.  (A lot more goes into each heading but this is the simplified version)  Not sure if this is the right way to do it but it keeps it manageable for me. 

Phase 1 - bodywork and complete paint job
Phase 2 - Interior
Phase 3 - drive train, suspension, brakes, wheels, etc
Phase 4 - Misc finish projects and make it pretty stuff

After the body is completed I am putting it back in storage until April/May.  This will allow me to figure out what I want to do next.  The body work and paint is costing me 1/3 of what I was quoted by several shops.  So I thought my $15K budget was doable.  However, at this point in my research for the upcoming phases, I don't think I can keep on budget, if it goes over I may have to sell it.  I'll do my best.

Would just love to jump to Phase 3!!  Just curious - question for the guys who have done this.....everyday the engine choice for me changes.  I settle for one idea and completely change my mind the next day.  I'm a Viper guy so somedays I'm even toying with the idea of putting a gen2 V10 and tranny in it (found a package for $3K).  Then I think about the new hemi's and driving a more reliable car, jump back to a stroked 360, 440 six pack would be cool, found a 520HP 340 for $3900,  hey...I could even put in an LS1 and have everyone on earth hate me!!  AAAARRRGGHHH!! 

Did everyone else who is not doing a pure restoration go through this with engine choice? 

How did you guys decide what engine you put in?  (Discuss budget, but what else did you consider).

Offline Street_Challenged73

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Great looking progress! :2thumbs:  As for how I decided on my engine choice, I wanted to make a car that resembled what was available in that particular year (minus body color) and have stuck rather well to that plan.  Since a 340 was the largest available factory engine in '73, I found one that's date-correct to drop in.  However, I want to make it a very stout engine, so I'm planning on spending around $4,000 into the engine & that's with using a forged crank I already have (may even opt for a stroker kit to accommodate my future plans of having a stroked, twin-turbo 340-based engine). :biggrin:  My original plan was to keep within a $15K budget, but I'm already sitting at ~$10K as-is (including the purchase of the 340).  Chances are a more realistic budget for me is around $20K, which shouldn't be too hard to attain considering the majority of my body work has been completed and I just need to build the engine to my specifications and put together an interior (I have majority of what I need, aside from white plastic door/rear quarter panels). :thumbsup:
1973 Dodge Challenger......................The ongoing project. (00/----\00)
1991 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo....The sunny day cruiser (RTBoost)
1990 Toyota Celica GT Liftback...........The new daily & winter driver.
All-American Muscle: 'Cudas and Challengers...Still the Elite and always will be.

                                                                                             
                 
Street_Challenged73 from Wisconsin

Offline HP2

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Engine choices may come down to desired horsepower levels and what is easily availale when it comes time to decide. I forget, but you car didn't come with an engine, correct? What do you want to do with the car, what do you want to spend, do you have any type of driving objective in mind (bracket drags, SCCA, NASA, etc) or any visualization of what the mind's eye best combo is to match you packaging.

Big blocks = big power with big weight. Even if using lighter weight components, big blocks weigh a lot of pounds and you will notice the difference in the weight distribution of the car if ever driven vigorously through twisties. A lot of this can be equalized with heavier spring rates, which may/will require changes to your suspension plans. Not sure what you have in  mind there. Big blocks do produce a lot of power with ease, however, and can do it at reasonable rpm ranges. Great for cruising the drive in, filling the engine bay at shows, or the occasional pass down the drag strip.

Small blocks= decent power at decent weights. Great thing is you can get them in power levels that are better than many classic big block outputs. Downside is you usually have to get into special parts to get the cubic inches and output of a comparable big block, which can get expensive quickley. Also great for cruising, can be suprisingly fast at the drags, and can produce impeccable handling characteristics.

3rd Gen hemi= best compromise of big block output and small block weight with stroker kits available and electronic engine controls that can make a real beast managable enough for anyone to drive. Downside to that is the additional complexity of adapting electronics and troubleshooting when things go wrong. You've got a hybrid set up that may or may not be workable by the local Dodge dealer technician. It will get looks at the shows and you will interchangeably will get harrassed/praised by the mopar faithful for either adapting new technology or abandoning proven power combos.

Something a mopar guy also has access to are the intermediate blocks 383/400. These are the same architecture as the big 426 and 440 and use the same cylinder heads and internal parts, but come in a shorter block package that gives them a weight break against their bigger brothers but doesn't leave them as light as their smaller siblings. These have the advantage of being very plentiful (read cheap to aquire as there were millions of them made.) and can be stroked to 431, 451, and 496 inch packages for big output at lighter weights.

There is always the Hemi. While they are the baddest of the bad, it does seem like the crate program has put so many of them out there and so many our being put into new builds that unless you do something really different to them, they almost don't stand out any more (just my opinion, others may differ).

I'd dismiss the V10 thoughts as they will require sigificant mods to the engine bay, which you won't know about until you try to put it togther, AFTER you just spent all this time prepping and painting. FYI, the V10 is quite a bit longer than a V8 and will require significant firewall and/or radiator support mods to fit. It also lacks the same growl in teh exhaust note that seems to be an inherent expectation of a muscle car. Vipers sound plenty mean, but they are a completely different sound than a high compression V8.

Sorry I can't come right out and say, but the there are a lot of variables in there to consider at this point before you say this is what my ultimate Challenger should have for the ultimate power house.

Offline IMNCARN82

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I like the color!  Keep them pics coming!!  Looking GREAT!!!!  IMO 408 stroker.  :smokin:
'73 340 5 speed,RMS,BAER,... "Supercuda" (O[   ]||||[   ]O)  
'69 Dodge Charger 383,Auto                  (OiiiiiiiiiiIiiiiiiiiiiO)
13' Challenger R/T BlacktoP  6spd. (OO________OO)
71' Demon
75' Duster
87' Conquest TSI
56' Plaza
Boulder CO
Robert    "cuda bob"

Offline Travis72

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I think HP2 stated it VERY well, that it really comes down to what you realistically want to do with the car, otherwise you might regret the decision later.  While a 520 hp 340 would be sweet, it might not be the most streetable engine that you would want to drive on a daily basis.

Since you're a Viper guy, I think a V10 would have been a really cool choice since you're already familiar with that engine.  However if it requires the body mods that HP2 mentioned, then he's right it would suck to have to do that now that you're painting the engine bay and car.

Travis
72 Cuda

p.s. The car is looking great and has come a LONG way in a very short amount of time.  Nice work.

Offline BruteForce

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Did everyone else who is not doing a pure restoration go through this with engine choice?

I did. I was going to put a 383 in it (my 340 72 Challenger), and had even bought one (20 years ago) that has been sitting in my garage all this time. What swayed me back to the 340 was several mopar guys telling me:

1) The 340 could be redone to deliver plenty of power for a streetable car (400-500 hp).
2) The 340 would get that power at much better gas mileage than the 383.
3) The 383 would unbalance the car in turns.
4) The 340 was the car's original engine (not just numbers matching, it was the original block).
5) The 340, being smaller, made more room in the engine bay making the car easier to work on, easier to fit headers in, etc.
6) I'd need to stiffen the frame to handle more power from a souped up 383, a job I am not ready to undertake, nor am I willing to do tubbing. But I upgraded the brakes, sway bars, torsion bars, and springs to make it handle better with the upgraded 340.

I considered a belt driven supercharger for a while, mainly because I like the sound of them :-), but finally could not stomach the idea of cutting a hole in the hood, and I was a little concerned about how that would work going to the grocery store.

I then sold the 383 engine, and haven't regretted my choice.

My project isn't a numbers matching restoration, but I've been careful to keep all the parts I pulled off and upgraded.

Offline Grasshopper

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Wow!  Great information on choice of motors and reasoning behind them.  Thank you very much guys.  HP2 - thanks for taking the time to write a detailed response.  I'll try not to think about the motor for awhile until at least this phase is done.

Ok.  Started the paint on the body.  Just sprayed the first coat on top.  It is going to be a two toned car.  You can see it actually starting to look like a real car now!

Here is the latest:


Offline Grasshopper

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More of the same...

Offline Grasshopper

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Just a reminder of what it was a few weeks ago.  You don't realize how much work you are doing or how far you have come until you look at the early photos.  I'm glad you guys suggested doing a thread like this.