Do I even NEED all this? Am I going over the top?

[go-fish]

1) Cometics are an all around better gasket. There is a reason they are more $. You can re-use them, they seal better, if you want to run a little juice they won't blow (Multi-layered STEEL)
2) Only sonic checking will truelly tell you how far a bore oversize you can go. .030 pistons are popular so I would believe most BB's can go that far. Also, boring it alone to make power is like peepee-ing in the wind. If you just wanted to clean up the cylinders would be mor plausible. However if you do a stroker kit and it comes with .030 over slugs then bore it .030 and be done. It is not bad to stroke it and not bore it but that is how many of the "kits" come.
3) 10.8 with juice? You have to go Cometic MLS!

[go-fish]

Look around in here for you some heads.
http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=4069138&an=0&page=0&gonew=1#UNREAD
bb70duster has Complete Edelbrock heads, just freshened, 84 cc, $1000

Deals month after month.

[MEK-Dangerfield]

Jeff,

  I'm sorry if I missed this somewhere, but how do you plan to use this car? I think this is all overkill if you just want something for the street. My 440 is beefed up a little, but it's scary enough for me. Even with 3:23's in the rear, I have to be careful not to squeal the tires at a traffic light.


  Mike

[ViperMan]

Eh, I want a little scary.  I don't want to go big cam, 'cause it won't be comfortable to drive.  But I want something that can do 75 on the highway without rattling my ears off, but can make respectable times down the 1/4 mile.  I know I'll end up dragging it at some point - but never for money, or slips...  just bragging rights...

I want something that turns SOME heads at Carlisle, ya know?  Something that's not like every other car there, but on the same token not with the huge blower stickin' out the top, etc, etc etc...

I duneven know if I'm makin' sense anymore. 

Jeff

[Chryco Psycho]

cometics will not fail & are a must with Alum head IMO
 we used a block last year from a 77 Chrysler the cylinder walls were over .300 thick & with a minimum of .125 on the thrust side you could bore .350 over & still have minimum thickness , any block needs to be sonic checked but most 440 will easily handle .060 over although I found one block that left the factory too thin for even stock bore with only .100 on the thrust wall , ever wonder why some engine make more power
 if you are going to 500 ci then go to the 512 , it uses the longer rod & improves rod ratio over the 500" pkg & is the same cost , + it will not interfere with the pick up tube
 with Alum heads 10.8 will work on pump premium what you will need N2O for I have no idea , some changes may be needed to run N2O , I have never used it
 I have used Diamond pistons , good product

[go-fish]

I know what you want. You want a Hydraulic Roller 500+ inch, awesome flowing closed chamber heads and requisite intake all topped of with a little NOX. But, you want to do it on te cheap.
It is going to be hard as heck to do on a little money but you can either do it over a long time OR spend the money in the right places and bargain shop for the rest.
Figure out a dang goal and get the requisite machine work done, get your short block in order, get a good cam grind. Take two steps back,  figure out what heads you want, get an intake that works, then start piecing together everything else.
Easier said than done, huh?

[ViperMan]

Okay okay okay - hang on a second - even this thread is making my head spin.  

512 - got it.  We'll go 512.  YOU WIN!!  lol - no seriously, it makes sense, and the cost is the same, so duh.

But these freakin' heads...  That's the hang up.

Is there no way to make the 902's work at least close to the potential of a 915 with different pistons?  Is there no other way to reach the recommended 10.8:1?  I accept that it was my mistake learning about open vs. closed AFTER I picked up my block, but the whole point of "going with what I have" is that I can piece-meal my parts - crank, rods, pistons, machine work - instead of having to buy something in one-big lump sum, like a complete set of ready-to-run heads.

Porting .030 over I'm fine on.  512 I'm fine on...   Heads...  Well I'm scratchin' mine!

Jeff

[ViperMan]

I know what you want. You want a Hydraulic Roller 500+ inch, awesome flowing closed chamber heads and requisite intake all topped of with a little NOX. But, you want to do it on te cheap.
It is going to be hard as heck to do on a little money but you can either do it over a long time OR spend the money in the right places and bargain shop for the rest.
Figure out a dang goal and get the requisite machine work done, get your short block in order, get a good cam grind. Take two steps back,  figure out what heads you want, get an intake that works, then start piecing together everything else.
Easier said than done, huh?

No you're right - I want to do it gradually.  Not cheap - just not all at once.  But I gotta figure out the heads before I go messing with cam, stroke, etc...

[go-fish]

I would also recommend Diamonds. We got into some detonation on the dyno. I was scared when we pulled the head and they were black. Took 'em out and wiped them with a paper towel and the looked good as new. Any kind of hypereutectic would've been burnt through.

[go-fish]

No you're right - I want to do it gradually.  Not cheap - just not all at once.  But I gotta figure out the heads before I go messing with cam, stroke, etc...

No you don't. It is all good.
Let's break this build up in chunks. First off, build a short block. Get a stroker kit, take the block to the machine shop with the pistons. Get that part done and bag it with some with some desicant orwhatever to keep it moisture free.
Regroup, save some dough up, fiure out what direction you wanna go on the top end. Buy.
Regroup, save some scratch up, knock out the ignition, i.e. wires, dizzy, MSD, whatever...
Regroup, save some moolah, buy an expensive carb.... LOL

[Chryco Psycho]

the 902 can work but it will cost more for the stroker kits as I do not believe Brandon has a quench dome piston available , the 902 will have decent potential but typically $500 for porting , $450 for machining including hard seats for the exhaust , + valves,  retainers & locks $400 + valve springs $150 -250 = approx $1500 , how much are Brandons heads complete ?

[Chryco Psycho]

No you don't. It is all good.
Let's break this build up in chunks. First off, build a short block. Get a stroker kit, take the block to the machine shop with the pistons. Get that part done and bag it with some with some desicant orwhatever to keep it moisture free.
Regroup, save some dough up, fiure out what direction you wanna go on the top end. Buy.
Regroup, save some scratch up, knock out the ignition, i.e. wires, dizzy, MSD, whatever...
Regroup, save some moolah, buy an expensive carb.... LOL

 the only down side to this is you need to know if you are using Iron nor alum heads & what size combustion chambers to get the right piston
 for example you can order a piston for 9.8:1 with iron 902 [88cc] heads & later swap to alum heads but the combustion chamber has to be smaller by 10 cc at approx 78 cc to compensate for the heat loss , this will eliminate using Brandons or the Eddy RPM heads as the combustion chambers are 84 cc in both , you need to use an Indy SR or EZ  or the Bulldog head with78 cc Chambers

[KellysCuda aircard]

Eh, I want a little scary.  I don't want to go big cam, 'cause it won't be comfortable to drive.  But I want something that can do 75 on the highway without rattling my ears off, but can make respectable times down the 1/4 mile.  I know I'll end up dragging it at some point - but never for money, or slips...  just bragging rights...

I want something that turns SOME heads at Carlisle, ya know?  Something that's not like every other car there, but on the same token not with the huge blower stickin' out the top, etc, etc etc...

I duneven know if I'm makin' sense anymore. 

Jeff

What wrong with the blower man...   I also use dimond pistons and cometic gaskits

[go-fish]

the only down side to this is you need to know if you are using Iron nor alum heads & what size combustion chambers to get the right piston
 for example you can order a piston for 9.8:1 with iron 902 [88cc] heads & later swap to alum heads but the combustion chamber has to be smaller by 10 cc at approx 78 cc to compensate for the heat loss , this will eliminate using Brandons or the Eddy RPM heads as the combustion chambers are 84 cc in both , you need to use an Indy SR or EZ  or the Bulldog head with78 cc Chambers

True that. But I don't think he knows why he doesn't want aluminum. It's a fact that you can get into a set of aluminum heads sometimes cheaper than rebuilding from scratch an iron set.
The advantage goes to aluminum IMO.
I definately think his blown head gasket with aluminum heads theory is out the window especially with Cometics and head studs. Oh, you got closed chambers on all the aluminums, .....on and on.

[ViperMan]

the only down side to this is you need to know if you are using Iron nor alum heads & what size combustion chambers to get the right piston
 for example you can order a piston for 9.8:1 with iron 902 [88cc] heads & later swap to alum heads but the combustion chamber has to be smaller by 10 cc at approx 78 cc to compensate for the heat loss , this will eliminate using Brandons or the Eddy RPM heads as the combustion chambers are 84 cc in both , you need to use an Indy SR or EZ  or the Bulldog head with78 cc Chambers

There - see go-fish?  I was right!  ...  d@mmit there's no "sticking tongue out" emoticon on this board... 

lololol - just kiddin' bud!

go-fish is workin' his darndest to talk me into aluminum, and maybe he's workin' on me.  Just that everyone ELSE I talk to says, "Yeah you'll have leaking issues a good bit..."  I mean granted, replacing head gaskets on these things isn't THAT hard...  Just not something I want to do much.. ...or at all...

Now Neil, I got some prices from a guy here in town who does machine work - Hammaker Enterprises.  His prices to do the head were pretty cheap.  Of course I see the potential down-side to this - screw-ups or not doing what I want him to do or etc etc etc...  Probably the best idea is to get a head over to him and get some more accurate estimates.  Because if the difference is more around $200-$300, then the advantage still lies in that I can spend the $$$ here for the porting, then the $$$ for the machining, then the $$$ for the actual parts.

I'm not sworn off of aluminum.  I'm just not 100% ready to throw away what I already have in my possession - that's all.

While I'm posting, I just want to thank you guys for keeping the information pouring in.  I'm learning SO MUCH from you guys.  Neil, you just gotta talk a little slower for me!    lol!

Jeff

P.S.  Head studs - never thought of that...  That'd take some machining in both the head and the block, right?  Still NBD, I wouldn't think...