Author Topic: EYE CANDY �70 challenger 6.1 Hemi & 6-speed updated 6-29 video from Hot Rod (Read 117463 times)

thedodgeboys · « **Reply #120 on:** May 12, 2008 - 09:36:53 AM »

Quote from: shelbydogg on May 12, 2008 - 08:34:30 AM

I also use a return line system but you don't want your return fuel line in the area of the pickup. Cut it short so it just dupms back into the tank away from the input of the pump.

Thats the first time I have heard that one,

need more info please.

With the return in the sump it helps fill it up if the tank is low or during hard cornering.

Thanks

gkring · « **Reply #121 on:** May 12, 2008 - 10:17:07 AM »

If you setup the AEM for a return style fuel sysem you have to use a normal FI regulator and return the fuel to the tank. If you setup the AEM for fixed fuel pressure then you use the return style corvette filter and only have one fuel line to the engine. The AEM knows you have a fixed 45 PSI of fuel pressure and adds or subtracts fuel depending on the engine vacuum. At full throttle you have zero vacuum, so the fuel pressure acts normal at 45 PSI. At idle you have 15-20 inches (6-10 PSI) of vacuum, so the fuel pressure is 45 PSI plus another 6 of suction for a total of 51 pounds. When you tell the AEM you are returnless it does the adjusting on the fuel through the injector pulsewidth for you. On a return fuel system a vacuumn line hooked to the pressure regulator does the adjusting for you.

I prefer a return fuel system for any car that will have forced induction. Taken to the extreme if you run 45 pounds of boost on a returnless system that has a fixed PSI of 45, then at full power no fuel would come out of the injectors. Even at 20 pounds of boost you would have to have injectors big enough that can supply your horsepower needs at only 25 PSI of fuel pressure.

On a naturally aspirated car it does not matter, and you can have a little less clutter in the engine bay and less expense in regulators and fuel lines by running a returnless system.

As far as the return line, all OEM tanks dump the fuel back into the slosh tank where the pump is. What you don't want are air bubbles. As long as you dump below the fuel level you will be fine. If you cut the old feed line short and it was spraying above the fuel level, then you definitely want to point it away from the pump.

ShelbyDogg · « **Reply #122 on:** May 12, 2008 - 11:19:09 AM »

You dont want the return fuel to aerate the fuel by being too close to the input. Some of the pumps I've pulled from factory tanks just had a short 3"-4" tube that just returned the fuel into the side of the tank. Below or above the fuel level didn't matter. The fuel regulators
I use are different from the one that gkring uses; when my vacuum is high, my pressure is held at 45 lbs. When my vacuum drops under load, the pressure increases.

Quote from: gkring on May 12, 2008 - 10:17:07 AM

At full throttle you have zero vacuum, so the fuel pressure acts normal at 45 PSI. At idle you have 15-20 inches (6-10 PSI) of vacuum, so the fuel pressure is 45 PSI plus another 6 of suction for a total of 51 pounds.

gkring · « **Reply #123 on:** May 12, 2008 - 03:59:57 PM »

Quote from: shelbydogg on May 12, 2008 - 11:19:09 AM

You dont want the return fuel to aerate the fuel by being too close to the input. Some of the pumps I've pulled from factory tanks just had a short 3"-4" tube that just returned the fuel into the side of the tank. Below or above the fuel level didn't matter. The fuel regulators
I use are different from the one that gkring uses; when my vacuum is high, my pressure is held at 45 lbs. When my vacuum drops under load, the pressure increases.

No, we are the same. I worded it poorly. on a returnless fuel system the fuel pressure is fixed at the fuel rail at 45 PSI (or whatever you set it at). When the manifold is under vacuum it "acts" like it is at a higher pressure.

On a return system like shelbydogg is using the actual fuel pressure is going to change with manifold vacuumn. the point is with the AEM system you can run returnless fuel system where the fuel pressure is steady and the computer calculates the correct fuel adjustment, or you can run return system where the manifold vacuumn/pressure controls the actual fuel pressure which will flucturate depending on engine load. Both systems work well, you just click a setting in the AEM box to tell it which way you are running.

ShelbyDogg · « **Reply #124 on:** May 12, 2008 - 04:13:08 PM »

Both work well but the return line system is better all around for performance. With the vacuum controlled regulator, the engine thinks it has bigger injectors when the horsepower is needed, by allowing more pressure at the rails. Plus your fuel is always circulating and not sitting in the rails percolating.

thedodgeboys · « **Reply #125 on:** May 12, 2008 - 06:47:26 PM »

WOW!

Thanks Guys you all should start a EFi thred...

So gkring would you like to spend a weekend in Kansas City tuning my 6.1?

All expenses paid of cores.

It sounds like you have used the AEM stuff before and know your way around that software.

What are your thoughts on running closed loop or open?

Mopar shipped the stuff without the 02 sensors active I am planning to use them it should make it run better I think.

Have you looked at the mopar software yet?

What fuel regulator do you recommend? I was looking at the Aeromotive Compact EFI Fuel Pressure Regulator.

Any other suggestions?

Thanks a TON.

gkring · « **Reply #126 on:** May 12, 2008 - 11:06:49 PM »

I'm sure we could work something out. I bought an AEM with the intention of turbocharging my Lexus SC300, but never did. The car is sold to a buddy, but my AEM is sitting on the shelf. A wideband sensor is almost a must have. I have the add on AEM one if it will work on the Mopar computer we can try it. I think the Mopar computer is just an AEm with a mopar logo on it? All the AEM addons should work with it. Otherwise a standalone wideband will be needed to measure actual air fuel ratios. Much easier than older methods of tuning. As far as close loop or open the closed loop setup will give you better mileage.
I have used the classic FAST box extensively along with old school gen VI Accell DFI and Haltechs. I have also played with Electromotives, Big Stuff, Gen 7 DFI, and XFI FAST. I have never actually used an AEM, but I like the looks and options of it. any of the Aeromotive regulators work great. Just depends what fits and clears on your motor. I like the type you can screw directly into the fuel rail. the black one below is what you are talking about. I have had the old version of that, but you could not change the fittings out, making it hard to mount at the fuel rail. You would have to firewall mount it. the other you can mount on the fuel rail, probably at the back of the motor.

thedodgeboys · « **Reply #127 on:** May 13, 2008 - 08:05:12 PM »

yes the Mopar box is a rebranded AEM they did send a simple start up map but only off a dyno no street setup yet. So it will run I just have to tun it in.(i think)

I would like to have someone thats worked on one walk me through it or better yet allow me to help them do it right.

Thanks for all the input.

Street_Challenged73 · « **Reply #128 on:** May 13, 2008 - 09:58:54 PM »

Just thought I'd chime in on one of the comments by GKring. I too would highly suggest getting a wideband sensor so you can regulate your mixture better. If you end up having any questions about AEM's setup, I could probably check with some of the guys on another site who are certified AEM technicians.

71bigblock · « **Reply #129 on:** May 13, 2008 - 10:28:15 PM »

Wow, you guys are,

whooooosh,

right over my head.

I just hope mine works, lol.

thedodgeboys · « **Reply #130 on:** May 14, 2008 - 08:05:16 AM »

Quote from: 71bigblock on May 13, 2008 - 10:28:15 PM

Wow, you guys are,

whooooosh,

right over my head.

I just hope mine works, lol.

ME TOOOOOOOOOO!

Quote from: Street_Challenged73 on May 13, 2008 - 09:58:54 PM

Just thought I'd chime in on one of the comments by GKring. I too would highly suggest getting a wideband sensor so you can regulate your mixture better. If you end up having any questions about AEM's setup, I could probably check with some of the guys on another site who are certified AEM technicians.

That would be great to see if they have someone in the KC area. I would love some local support.

thedodgeboys · « **Reply #131 on:** May 17, 2008 - 10:51:37 PM »

Put my a arms on today

My breaks will be here on Thursday so I thought I better get ready for them so I can set her on all four.
First time in 7 years she has had 4 tires on at the same time.

NoMope Greg · « **Reply #132 on:** May 18, 2008 - 12:57:16 AM »

Engine installed, all four on the ground...not too much longer until you're cruising.

thedodgeboys · « **Reply #133 on:** May 24, 2008 - 08:54:22 PM »

Spent a day fighting fuel line locations mounting points for clips and stuff.

My breaks did not show up in ups by Friday so now its next week I guess.

Need to run my break hoses and power steering hoses to the hydro boost

& Trans cooler lines.

Found a good deal on (I think) on a 3 inch stainless steel exhaust with mufflers for $500.00

Have a great weekend everyone!

hemiken · « **Reply #134 on:** May 28, 2008 - 06:57:53 AM »

Hey DB,

How did you go with your fuel line buddy. And what is on the agenda next.....................

Author Topic: EYE CANDY �70 challenger 6.1 Hemi & 6-speed updated 6-29 video from Hot Rod (Read 117463 times)

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