the MOPAR Muscle Car market...buying VS. selling

[bb71challenger]

I agree with almost everything you wrote. I think the market will continue to fall but it will eventually come back again. In the early to mid 80's the prices were super low then came the first value increases. The market grew and grew until in the early 90's it crashed. The market stayed kind of stagnant for a while then growth started again. Even though higher production versions like /6 and 318 cars have been and will continue to be made into tribute cars, eventually even those cars will dry up to the point that demand will again surge ahead of supply. I did not buy my car as an investment and it will never be worth a whole lot being a 318 car. I bought my car to drive, and someday next year when it is done I will do just that  

[DAYTONA]

I agree with almost everything you wrote. I think the market will continue to fall but it will eventually come back again. In the early to mid 80's the prices were super low then came the first value increases. The market grew and grew until in the early 90's it crashed. The market stayed kind of stagnant for a while then growth started again. Even though higher production versions like /6 and 318 cars have been and will continue to be made into tribute cars, eventually even those cars will dry up to the point that demand will again surge ahead of supply. I did not buy my car as an investment and it will never be worth a whole lot being a 318 car. I bought my car to drive, and someday next year when it is done I will do just that  

...you have apparently been around the hobby for a long while too

...bought my first T/A for $4,900, a low mile matching 4spd orange car....now, they commonly bring over $100K with asking prices getting even higher

...paid $9k for my first Daytona, low mile 440 4spd, now, $150K on up

etc etc....the market crashed in the early 90s and then came back like a lion again...many people on this forum are decades younger than me, the interest in MOPARS is still there and will be for a long time   JMO JMO JMO

... I know a guy with a crusty 70 Barracuda conv that turned down $40K for the car a couple of years ago, now it sits out in the snow/mud for the final destruction...won't fix it, won't sell it, won't take care of it, won't garage it anymore

[bb71challenger]

...you have apparently been around the hobby for a long while too

...bought my first T/A for $4,900, a low mile matching 4spd orange car....now, they commonly bring over $100K with asking prices getting even higher

...paid $9k for my first Daytona, low mile 440 4spd, now, $150K on up

etc etc....the market crashed in the early 90s and then came back like a lion again...many people on this forum are decades younger than me, the interest in MOPARS is still there and will be for a long time   JMO JMO JMO

... I know a guy with a crusty 70 Barracuda conv that turned down $40K for the car a couple of years ago, now it sits out in the snow/mud for the final destruction...won't fix it, won't sell it, won't take care of it, won't garage it anymore

That is just too sad. The 71 vert Challenger I could have bought in 86 was eventually snapped up for peanuts. That guy put a top on it and left it to rot in the weather. It literally has like 2-3 inches of MUD dried on all the interior surfaces from all the wind storms and some really wet weather a few years back. He says it is worth 40-60k just as it sits........and so it sits. I hope I never become an owner who never intends to do anything with my car. Getting off on the trip that he has it and you dont seems to be the only pleasure the car brings him 

[bb71challenger]

I do have to say though that I wish I could have had 1/4 to 1/2 of the experiences with the musclecars that you have had Daytona 

[jeryst]

People forget that the people that want these cars, are the boomers, and we're slowly fading away, and along with us goes the major demand for these cars. Couple that with the fact that there are still tens of thousands of these cars, maybe even hundreds of thousands, in the process of being restored, and supply will be much more than the demand for them.

[DAYTONA]

People forget that the people that want these cars, are the boomers, and we're slowly fading away, and along with us goes the major demand for these cars. Couple that with the fact that there are still tens of thousands of these cars, maybe even hundreds of thousands, in the process of being restored, and supply will be much more than the demand for them.

...you would think, but that doesn't explain the price explosion of 50s MOPARS....I was astounded at some of the prices they brought at BJ....many were higher than HEMI CUDAS

[DAYTONA]

I do have to say though that I wish I could have had 1/4 to 1/2 of the experiences with the musclecars that you have had Daytona 

...I was born at the perfect time to experience it first hand....then you live to be 119 years old like me,  and you have plenty of time to tell the storys, OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER 

...........it's been a fun ride

[chrisII]

altho I do not believe all demand for these cars will dry up, I do believe that in 10 to 15 years Im more likely to be able to afford one of my dream cars than I am today. over the last few years the "baby boomers", mostly guys in there late 50s to late 60s have driven up the costs of these cars. in 15 years most of these guys will be into there 70s and just will not enjoy them like they do today. if they do not sell them before they die off the estates will be unloading old muscle cars for whatever they bring.. I see the prices going up once more in a few years , but I may be mistaken. I am pretty sure that in 15 years the demand will have declined, and supply will have increased as more will be for sale. 

[matt63]

The recession may last a year or so.  Some say it is a consumer driven recession and corporate America will bounce back once things are under control in a year or so.  Once the confidence comes back I don't see why muscle car prices wouldn't hold.  Perhaps demand from offshore will increase.  Who knows.

[jeryst]

...you would think, but that doesn't explain the price explosion of 50s MOPARS....I was astounded at some of the prices they brought at BJ....many were higher than HEMI CUDAS

It's like I said before. The collectors, investors, and speculators are now going after a segment of the market that is low priced. It will heat up as others jump in, but it will still be just a bubble. If you get in now, you can make some money, but if you stay in too long, the same thing will happen.

[DAYTONA]

It's like I said before. The collectors, investors, and speculators are now going after a segment of the market that is low priced. It will heat up as others jump in, but it will still be just a bubble. If you get in now, you can make some money, but if you stay in too long, the same thing will happen.

...I didn't mean to make it sound like I was arguing with you, hope you didn't take it that way...I follow your thinking and agree to a large degree...that kind of explains the Vettes being RED HOT this year, they had been somewhat dormant for a while

...I'm interested in everyones view/thoughts, we may all be right, or all be wrong to an extent....only time will tell the true story

[moparnut]

You dont know what financial straights the sellers are in.Maybe they have a huge mortguage payment and will lose their house/business if they dont sell a car.People also panic when they feel life is crashing down on them.I have sold some cars(68 charger r/t,68 charger r/t clone and 68 coronet r/t) 5-7 years ago,2 were sold to buy my ranch and one was sold because of uncle sam.I still made a healthy sum(almost twice what i paid) on the cars but did let them go way too cheap for the market prices.But i look for bargains and wont pay the going price for a car.The money i didnt get for selling the cars too cheap,didnt even come close to how much i have made on my property value increase.Its worth more than twice what i paid for it,even tho i had to sacrifice some mopars to do it.

[ViperMan]

I'll say this much...

Speaking for the generation after yours, I must say that things are a little harder today.  Cars cost 10 times as much as they did 30-40 years ago, houses the same thing.  Incomes are up too, but I can't say that they're up 10 times as much.  My father got his 'Cuda for somewhere around $3,500 and went into the Military, where he paid $0 for tuition.  I bought my first car for $27,000, and have over $40,000 in tuition debt.  My wife is paying $8,000 for her first (used) car, but has over $60,000 in tuition debt!!  Our income is close to $70,000 annually, which still just barely pays the bills.

I had to penny pinch to buy my 'Cuda.  In fact, if I hadn't found the one I did at it's 11,000 price tag, I wouldn't have one today.  The next cheapest price I found was $9,000 for a rusted body of a Cuda - no interior, no motor, trans, etc.  The next price UP was $25,000 for a 340 'Cuda in only slightly better condition than the one I bought.  I pretty much skip over the section at Carlisle with $100,000+ price tags.

Eventually, the prices on these cars will dip down into the range that my generation can afford.  They'll start getting snatched up again when we realize that we can afford them.  It may take quite some time, but eventually, as we progress into our careers and the like, they'll rise in value again.  However, I see things like fuel prices becoming a big concern for everything, especially the classic collectors market.  Eventually there's going to be no gas.  And when there's no gas, 440's and 426's and 528's are going to be pretty much useless.  These cars will drop into 4 digit-prices so that the people who can afford to transplant a Hydrogen power plant or God-knows-what engine into it can do so.

I was actually just thinking the other day that I'd like to pick up a "General Lee" year Charger (not an actual General Lee, but that year/body style.)  Of course, the recent Dukes of Hazzard movie ramped up prices on those cars by trashing like 30 or 40 of them...

Jeff

[moparnut]

Yes,even tho 3k was ALOT of money in 1970(What cost $3000 in 1970 would cost $16790.54 in 2007).Technology cost money,all the new cars are engineering marvels.I for one dont want my mopar as a daily driver since i drive 40k a year for work.It would be way too uncomfortable compared to my 06 magnum.But you are right,inflation cost much more then 1970,but you are also getting MUCH more in a car these days.
Heres another calc(What cost $20000 in 2007 would cost $3573.44 in 1970).Not far off considering the average car today is around 20k)
http://www.westegg.com/inflation/

[ViperMan]

But you are right,inflation cost much more then 1970,but you are also getting MUCH more in a car these days.

You're absolutely correct.  So therefore, why would we go spending 150,000 or even 40,000-60,000 for a car with outdated technology, an outdated engine, rough ride and poor brakes and so-on-and-so-forth when the same amount of money buys you a new Lincoln, Cadillac, even a BMW!

Don't get me wrong - I LOVE the classic muscle cars!  I love driving my 'Cuda.  But it's very difficult for someone my age to part with that kind of money for something that can't be driven everyday, and in the common opinion, comes with less than what our money can get us today.

That, and I'm spending almost $1,500 a month in school loans.  Doesn't leave much to blow on big-boy toys.

Jeff