Chrysler goes electric

[72hemi]

Just saw this check it out! Pricing will be interesting.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/26850919#26850919

[71bigblock]

Holy crap, thats awesome!   

[NoMope Greg]

Very cool.  It looks like the van and Jeep did hybrid the right way, similar to how diesel locomotives work.  The knock on all-electric vehicles has always been the limited range - Hemi 'Cudas are more practical for 100 mile trips than the GM EV1.  These vehicles combine the mileage benefits of an electric vehicle in local driving with the practicality of liquid fueled cars.  If they can get 50 mpg (in a mini-van!) with gas, imagine what they could get with diesel. 

[RaptorF229]

I have been waiting to get an electric car for so long. I can't wait for one.

[jeryst]

Like I said a couple of years ago, an all electric version of the Challenger would be awesome.

[NoMope Greg]

Like I said a couple of years ago, an all electric version of the Challenger would be awesome.

Jeryst, with all due respect to my fellow Mopar lover, an all electric version of the Challenger would suck, unless you stay within about a 35 mile radius of home.  With present battery technology, you can't go more than about 80 miles on a charge, then you gotta wait at least four hours to "refuel" your car, maybe as much as eight hours if the only outlet you can find is 110V.  Do the same thing with a liquid fueled vehicle - even StRoKer's 4 mpg beast - and you refuel in 5 minutes - 10 if you need snacks and a potty-stop.

Imagine that you wanted to travel to Pittsburgh to see a Steelers game from your home in Falls Creek.  If you take your electric Challenger, if the game starts at 1:00 PM and finishes at 4:00 and you want to leave directly after, you'd have to leave no later than 6:00 AM and arrive at 8:00 AM to give your car sufficient time to recharge.  Meantime, I take a great big 5 mpg gas hog RV, taking an extra 30 minutes because I'm driving slower.  I get to sleep in and don't leave until after you've already arrived in Pittsburgh - and I still get time to tailgate for a couple of hours before the game.   

Until battery technology catches up to the point that you can drive to Grandma's house 400 miles away in a day and recharge the car in a matter of minutes, practical all-around cars will continue to require some kind of liquid fueled engines, even if all they do is drive a generator.  That's how diesel locomotives work.  Plus, in time that battery pack is going to need to be replaced and that'll be big money.   

Besides, part of the appeal of muscle cars is the sound of the engine.  All-electric cars are virtually silent - where's the fun in that? 

[72hemi]

I have to disagree a little with you. Current technology allows for cars to travel between 150 and 200 miles on a single charge not just 80, and then if you throw a generator at it (like the minivan and Jeep in the video) that range increases to roughly 400 miles on 8-9 gallons of gas, plus with the electric motors you have a constant torque curve across the rpm range. Granted I still think there is something political going on and that it is possible to get triple digit fuel economy and over 400 hp (actually I don't think I know because I have seen it multiple times).

[NoMope Greg]

I have to disagree a little with you. Current technology allows for cars to travel between 150 and 200 miles on a single charge not just 80, and then if you throw a generator at it (like the minivan and Jeep in the video) that range increases to roughly 400 miles on 8-9 gallons of gas, plus with the electric motors you have a constant torque curve across the rpm range. Granted I still think there is something political going on and that it is possible to get triple digit fuel economy and over 400 hp (actually I don't think I know because I have seen it multiple times).

John, you actually made my point, which is that a purely electric car (no liquid-fueled engine) isn't yet practical.  Jeryst wants an all electric Challenger - no liquid fuel.  Yes, it may be possible to get a vehicle to go 150-200 miles on a single charge, but not with a vehicle that weighs 4000 lbs and will do the quarter in the 12's.  Just as with a gasoline car, lay into it to take full advantage of the torque available from those electric motors and you quickly draw down the range of the batteries.  The hybrid set-up of the van and Jeep are still the preferred set-up, if you can get the price down to be competitive with a current gasoline powered car.  As fuel prices climb, we're getting closer to that.  And, as battery technology progresses (or fuel cells), the feasability of an all-electric car being practical as an only vehicle will become reality.

That said, I wouldn't mind having one of the People Pods as a daily driver. 

[72hemi]

I see what you are saying. For long distance travelers especially the all electric currently isn't the best route. I know for myself I wouldn't be able to take it to visit my parents as they live 250 miles away. BUt for me and my daily driving I could go almost a month on a single charge. The price on these cars is going to be the make or break deal for them. If Chrysler can get the price down below the competition it will knock one out of the park for Chrysler for a change. Has anyone seen who killed the electric car? Pretty interesting documentary on earlier GM electric vehicle program.

[KZ]

Its about time, I've spoken before about Chrysler always trailing the pack in the hybrid/alternative fuel dept. The important thing is that the automakers START with SOMETHING other than purely gasoline engines or even diesels. I am convinced if they put the $, research and hard work in that we can get off the oil nipple. But you have to first start, and this is an important step.

[Beck]

bring on the electric cars!
i try and keep reasonably abreast of the latest developments and emerging technologies in this field, and the future is bright.
there are some awesome energy storage advances happening (supercapacitors, nano-engineered eco batteries) albeit many still in early stages.

i firmly believe that once the average person gets the chance to drive a well sorted modern electric car (maybe next generation: 200+ mile range, dump charge capable (20min), 400+hp, solar power harvesting paint) for an extended period of time,
the idea of driving a gas powered car will start to seem like watching black and white tv when you could be watching colour.

no vibrations, no warm up, no smells, no maintenance, instant torque, a healthy conscience (knowing you're not wasting a finite resource drilled from a foreign country, the burning of which is fueling global climate change) etc...

get the public loving electric cars, then they'll be more than enough cheap gas for classic vehicles.

[nivvy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pSwwbMorq0&feature=related

 

[duodec]

I rather wish the Jeep had a diesel as the range extending engine.  A small diesel optimized to run at a single speed running a generator optimized to provide the most efficiency at that speed would be about as good as it gets.  But gas will do.

We see.  In 2012 my Liberty will be 10 years old, and it may be time to look for a newer vehicle then.

[jeryst]

Jeryst, with all due respect to my fellow Mopar lover, an all electric version of the Challenger would suck, unless you stay within about a 35 mile radius of home.  With present battery technology, you can't go more than about 80 miles on a charge, then you gotta wait at least four hours to "refuel" your car, maybe as much as eight hours if the only outlet you can find is 110V.  Do the same thing with a liquid fueled vehicle - even StRoKer's 4 mpg beast - and you refuel in 5 minutes - 10 if you need snacks and a potty-stop.

Imagine that you wanted to travel to Pittsburgh to see a Steelers game from your home in Falls Creek.  If you take your electric Challenger, if the game starts at 1:00 PM and finishes at 4:00 and you want to leave directly after, you'd have to leave no later than 6:00 AM and arrive at 8:00 AM to give your car sufficient time to recharge.  Meantime, I take a great big 5 mpg gas hog RV, taking an extra 30 minutes because I'm driving slower.  I get to sleep in and don't leave until after you've already arrived in Pittsburgh - and I still get time to tailgate for a couple of hours before the game.   

Until battery technology catches up to the point that you can drive to Grandma's house 400 miles away in a day and recharge the car in a matter of minutes, practical all-around cars will continue to require some kind of liquid fueled engines, even if all they do is drive a generator.  That's how diesel locomotives work.  Plus, in time that battery pack is going to need to be replaced and that'll be big money.   

Besides, part of the appeal of muscle cars is the sound of the engine.  All-electric cars are virtually silent - where's the fun in that? 

Sorry, no offense intended, but its you who is not keeping up. If you dont believe me, check out www.teslamotors.com

Their sports car does 0-60 in 3.9 seconds, has a top speed of around 140mph, and a range of 244 miles per charge. I could easily drive from Falls Creek to Pittsburgh, and back again. Still expensive, but the technology is evolving at a much more rapid pace than most people would believe. In another five years, the range will double, and the charging time will decrease. Electrics have almost countless advantages. For example, unlike a combustion engine, they have constant torque, making them unbelievable performance machines. Also, unlike combustion engines, with a flip of a switch, they can easily go from pure performance to pure economy modes. With motors on all 4 wheels, they can adjust the traction to each wheel independently, allowing for true, traction-sensing 4-wheel drive.

So, I stand by my statement that an all electric Challenger would be awesome, as it would beat the pants off of any of the ones now offered. Not having a nice exhaust note would truely suck, though.

[NoMope Greg]

No offense taken; I hope you understand that I intended no offense either.   

Actually, I did know about Tesla Motors.  Until their recent move to Menlo Park, they were headquartered about 40 miles from me, so they've been featured in the local news media, plus I'd seen the recent episode of "Supercars" on SPEED Channel, so I was aware of the performance.  The torque that electric motors can deliver instantly is the whole reason they're used in locomotives.  Put that into a lightweight car and you have the potential for amazing acceleration.  I particularly like their anecdote about asking passengers to turn on the radio and then nailing the throttle.

I was also aware that efficiency has been increasing with the advent of the same modern controls that make modern hybrids livable and better battery and motor designs, but I was not aware how much they had improved.  If, in fact, a Tesla can make a trip to the football game and back on one charge, that's pretty amazing and practical for many people.  In fact, for 95% of my personal needs, a current-generation electric car would do just fine. (No pun intended)  I do wonder about winter, when battery efficiency falls and how much that costs in range.  (I suppose anyone that could afford to buy this car, could afford a hotel room or a rental car and a tow truck.)  I also doubt that you could get similar numbers out of something the size of a Challenger.  If this little roadster, barely larger than the Lotus Elise it shares some parts with, weighs almost 800 lbs more than that same Elise, how much would a relatively large car like a Challenger weigh?  If the current car weighs 4000 lbs, could an electric Challenger weigh less than 4500?  How will that affect efficiency?


I don't really disagree with you; a livable electric car would be pretty cool and I have no doubt the day is coming.  Coupled with the introduction of cleaner power plants - wind, solar, geothermal, hydro (and hopefully someday soon, my favorite, fusion), electric vehicles could prove a big help in weaning humanity from dependence on fossil fuels, with all the attendant problems they create.  I'm also a big fan of efficiency -   I drive my little UAV as a daily driver not because I can't afford anything better but because I could buy it for next to nothing and drive 80 on the freeway and still get 30 mpg. Sure, it's nothing compared to the power and efficiency of the Tesla, but it only cost me $2100 out the door.    I can buy a lot of gas for the $107,000 I save over the price of a Tesla.   OK, so maybe I'm a little cheap.   

My point was really more about the practicality of current technology than efficiency or performance.  When an all-electric car can be fully recharged in 20 minutes or solar technology gets to the point that you can actually run a car off what can be harvested from the sun and the costs of owning one are similar to a liquid-fueled vehicle, then electrics will come into their own.  Until that day comes, I think the practical disadvantages of electrics will continue to have many cars using some sort of liquid fuel.