Vin tags back in the day

[Tower Rat 95B]

 Vin Tags seems like just the mention of them leads to post of its illegal to touch , move reproduce  or even get a replacement no matter what the case my be,,,, and I do agree with that but it was not always that way at one point in time you could buy a new vin tag right from the dealer, vin tags had part #'s and were replaceable, I remember a post with pics (can't find know) from a NOS dealer (bill Rolik) he posted pics right out of the parts manual for a new vin tag and I believe rivets too, that was probly on moparts.com ........   Here is another vin tag  memory, Carlisle  around 1984 I found a vendor that was selling in plain view on his parts lay out blank NOS vin tags, they were black with the the Chrysler logo 20 bucks each and he had a a least 100 tags, I saw them myself, at the time it did not seem like anything but after seeing that Bill Rolik post on dealer Vin tags I wonder when did Vin tags become taboo...    Anyone else ever see legit replacement vin tags way back in the day? Got any pics? I'll try to find those pics from the parts manual, there interesting .

[Tower Rat 95B]

 Here is a pic of blank vin tag.

 

 And the back side.

[Tower Rat 95B]

 And here is the vin tag listing in the parts book and another blank vin tag.   Any takers on this, apparently at one time a new vin tag was as easy as going to the dealer and just ordering one.   What about that back side shot , I have never taken a tag off but wonder why they would only paint one side.......

 

[Tower Rat 95B]

 Sorry about pic size I don't know how to make it smaller.......

[Moparal]

Everything has part numbers.  I don't see any vins stamped on them. Stamping vin numbers is the issue.  Roll back time 35 yrs ago and then go up to the parts counter and ask them to stamp a vin on that tag for you while you wait.  Bet it did'nt happen. 

Every single item on a car has to have a parts number to be itemized.  Show me a vin that has been ordered with it stamped already.  Bits of info can be taken out of content.  Knowing a complete full detailed story is another.  I sure need more documentation than just what your showing to even think it was a possibility back then. 

Why even bring this up?   You need a vintag stamped?     Order me a 72 hemi cuda tag over the counter please

[Tower Rat 95B]

  I bring it up cause its cool info to me and also we have a form here just for this kind of thing, nothing  else just trying to get the whole story not a piece..

 btw I really do not understand a sad wave , what does that mean?

 

[hemiken]

What would $20 equate to in this day and age.  Must of been a lot of money back then

[Moparal]

I believe the list price was 35 cents?  Or 2.10 bucks according to the sheet.   I am saying that with my sad wave, you weren't going to buy a stamped vintag at the dealership.

Laws change. But as far as I know, you may of had to take the unstamped vin and proof to a dot back then and maybe the laws were changed to now the dot has a different vin stamp of thier own since crooks can even be in government areas doing black market stuff.

Seeing pictures of un stamped vins and a price and part number in a book does not even come close to convincing me it was ok to stamp your own vins back in the day.  I don't buy that.

Show some more stuff you dug up. And in Chrysler authentic manuals showing the docs and pages and how to get it stamped back then with the procerdures that were involved. I am sure there were tec bullitens in the same book as far as foot notes.  Like must be state lic and bonded to purchase. Like I said, laws are involved even if you hadn't seen it yet.

[Tower Rat 95B]

 Ok  not trying to convince anyone of anything just trying to under stand the way it was back in the day  and to cap it off the vin stuff is aways interesting to me for what ever reason......... Any way I don't have a parts manual but I would think some one else on the site might and they too could look up this entry as I do believe that at one time it was a simple as just ordering a new tag, why else would it be in the parts manual ....

 btw these pics came from another site they are not mine but I think there legit....

 

[Moparal]

Ok  not trying to convince anyone of anything just trying to under stand the way it was back in the day  and to cap it off the vin stuff is aways interesting to me for what ever reason......... Any way I don't have a parts manual but I would think some one else on the site might and they too could look up this entry as I do believe that at one time it was a simple as just ordering a new tag, why else would it be in the parts manual ....

 btw these pics came from another site they are not mine but I think there legit....

 

I believe yer sincere   But also read the last post comments about foot notes and stuff.  Plus the pics you gave are not stamped vins, so refer again back to my last post

[Tower Rat 95B]

Show some more stuff you dug up. And in Chrysler authentic manuals showing the docs and pages and how to get it stamped back then with the procerdures that were involved. I am sure there were tec bullitens in the same book as far as foot notes.  Like must be state lic and bonded to purchase. Like I said, laws are involved even if you hadn't seen it yet.

 Ok Moparal,  I reread your last and I think you want to see what I have and here it is a big fat nothing  but a link to the thread that perked my interest in the blank vin tags and a long a go trip to Carlisle  were I saw blank vins for sale.   

 My screen name at moparts is the same as here, also bremotorsports is Bill Rolik a long time respected NOS parts dealer he is well known and I believe his post is legit... I also asked him the same as you ask me about how did one get the vin tag stamped........



   http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=3807137&page=0&fpart=all&vc=1

 Any way read the moparts  thread and see what ya think........

[Moparal]

   Here's what he said about your question. And he didn't know... (quote It never entered my mind to ever ask about stamping kits or rivets. I was too busy with my regular mechanical work in the dealership service department, and my "extra bonus" assignment as the staff water leak expert. When I left there for the "next" dealership (.50 per hour raise: that was a big deal in 72) I retired as "Frogman-Water Leak Guru".  Duster cowls (just above the door hinges) and Fury wagon quarter windows were the worst!

Bill Rolik )

He just new you could order a blank vintag was all.  You could ask him if there are any foot notations that go with what he showed in the book.  ECS does chevy ford and dodge so he will be all over in comments about the hobby. Since Chevy guys do vin swaps all the time. Never seen a vin number stamped on a fender or hood or quarter either as far as numbers match.

I had read that post when it was first posted.  It hadn't solved any issues yet other than someone may have dropped a blank in his car. The ford assembly line guy said when they had a blank mixed in with the rest that WERE stamped, they chucked it. And the one guy about harley's said what a biker back then would do. Stamp their own numbers. But as far as proof of Chrysler over the counter stamped vin tags and ready to go...nope , didnt see it. But I can see how you as well as others would be interested since it is discussed alot.   Barry saw that thread. You bet he did.  But you also saw he wasn't going to get in a debate on it.  There is no proof. Just a part number like I said. That same book Bremmer had should of flipped over to the vin stamping die sets. It would of been in there too and he would of posted it if he had seen it. I am sure he didn't.  He was the water boy

Ecs doesn't even do metal vin tags on his site. And he is an authorized repop dealer for decals.  His proof was only hear say as it was. Look at his site yourself

http://www.ecsautomotive.com/                 And you wont see nothing but decals n stuff.     

If it was legal back then, there are enough people still alive today to make comments on this as being legal and none have come forward over the years.   Just don't see it.

Granted lots of people didn't know better back then and thought it was ok to swap a vin on a say 318 car to drive another 318 car, but it wasn't legal.    I'm Alyerpal2 over there by the way.   

[Alaskan_TA]

Some VIN tag basics;

Automobile manufactures can stamp VIN tags for new cars.

Under certain circumstances, they could & would issue a new VIN tag if the old one disappeared. As an example, a "theft recovery" where the original VIN was removed by thieves.

I have only heard of one case where Chrysler actually did this for someone. The car was stolen & recovered & the VIN tag was missing. The owner persued the matter with Chrysler, the US federal authoriteis and the local (to him) Canadian police department. It took almost three years of paperwork & follow ups, but he did get a Chrysler issued VIN tag. This was back in the 1980's & the Chrysler VIN tags they had then look different than the did on our cars. He know has a VIN tag that looks very out of place, but it IS Chrysler issue.

Was it worth all the time and trouble? Hard to say.

I do not know if they still can or will do it anymore (before anyone asks) but now that all states have programs where they can issue state VIN tags for cars that are missing their original tags, I would be very surprised if Chrysler would bother to td this anymore. State issued tags would take a whole lot less time for sure.

As far as the blank tags in the parts book, dealerships could order them for specific cases (theft recovery again) but neither Chrysler or any dealership was allowed to sell blanks. I do not know for sure, but I would bet that Chrysler would stamp the numbers and not send out a blank tag.

The guy selling blanks if caught & convicted would be subject to time in a federal prison.

[ozrt4406]

JUST AS A MATTER OF INTEREST HOW COULD A PERSON SELLING BLANK VIN TAGS GO TO PRISON, WHAT WOULD HE BE CHARGED WITH, ? ITS A LEGITIMATE TAG NOT REPRODUCED WITHOUT LICENCE , ITS A NOS PART , ITS IN THE PARTS BOOK WITH A NUMBER , IT DOES NOT HAVE  OR PREPORT TO HAVE A VIN NUMBER ISSUED TO IT, SO WHAT IS THE OFFENSE OF SELLING A NOS CHRYSLER SUPPLIED PART?

[Alaskan_TA]

VIN tags are a Federal Control Item, as such they have laws that govern how they can & will be used.

Selling blank ones in not allowed for in those laws. 

If it were, you can bet that car theives would be the main customers for them.