Author Topic: Just got my used 727....now what?  (Read 24154 times)

Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #75 on: May 13, 2009 - 02:29:40 PM »
Ok, thats great...but how does one FIND that "perfect" converter..... :clueless:
Some search their whole lives looking for the perfect converter..................  :lol:

Seriously,for what you are going to do,the one from Summit would be fine.
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.




Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #76 on: May 13, 2009 - 02:31:23 PM »
Ok, maybe that is why he suggested a 3k.....I had said I was planning, at some point, to go to 3.55s or 3.91s in the rear......

Still , seems like 3k is high.........
:grinno:  You do not have the engine to warrant that kind of a converter.
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline shadango

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3920
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #77 on: May 13, 2009 - 05:04:21 PM »
Terry, Thanks for all the help you have given!

I am not kidding when I say that if you were even half the distance (you are 11 hrs from me according to yahoo...yeah, I checked) I would have been at your shop....Its easy to tell when someone knows what they are talking about, even when the person asking doesn't (thats me...LOL).

All of you guys who have allowed me to bounce stuff off of you and have given feedback, well...thanks big time.....itreally helps sort stuff out.

I talked to the relative who sent me to these guys and he said he is running the stock convertoer in his cuda...though he has no plans to beat on it (its a full-off resto that has taken 5 yrs so far...and still going!). Me, I want to have some fun.   :)

Unless they come back with some ridiculous cost, or say that they will not back their work, this shop seems to be an ok place....at least the builder is being overly cautious!

And the convertor you suggested Terry is on my list for my next summit order....thatcalifornia one is also a close second.....gonna stew on it for a bit.

(Man I hope the wife doesnt check on what I am spending so far!  :eek2:  )

I will keep everyone posted as I hear back etc.   

Offline shadango

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3920
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #78 on: May 13, 2009 - 05:40:23 PM »
Ok, just talked to the shop.

Here's the deal:

-I have a bad front planetary...he says I have a 3 pinion and they will put a 4 pinion in ($126.88)
- bad direct drum -- new one is $7.88

He says thats it as far as bad hard parts.

Lots of water in there he said but no big deal.

He is going with a masterkit with kolene (sp?) steels and kevlar clutches

Sonax rear servo

 transgo kit p22171 (I may have this kit number wrong).....he says its an agressive kit but not full race.

He says I will have really firm shifts but streetable...says that even with the 318 and 2.76s I shoudl be able to "break the tires loose sideways"....LOL...dont know if I buy THAT but ok.   :bigsmile:

Also, the first thing this guy (the owner) said to me when he heard it was me is that I do NOT need/want a high stall...he said that stock will be fine and is included in the price).....he said a high stall (3k like his guy had said) would make it feel like that tranny was slipping etc.....so not sure what went down there...he had deferred me to his builder when I visited and then changed the plan now..... :clueless:  Guess they talked about it and changed their plan....

He says I have a 2.9 lever in there but in his opinion I dont need the 3.8 or 4.0....not with the kit he is using.....but he will install it if I can get him one or if he can find one in his shop......

Also need a neutral safety switch,.

Grand total......$1,018. Ouch.  But again that includes a reman stock torque converter.

But, figuring the $200 in hardparts that the last guy DIDNT know about, plus the kevlar clutches that were not in the last quote, and the last guy still hadnt come up with afirm price but was up to $750 for the basic rebuild plus just the shift kit....so, I think the price is fair I guess.

Feeling OK about this now I guess.   The owner seemed to really know what I want (he kept saying that...LOL).....

I will be glad when this puppy is done and installed and running well!


Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #79 on: May 13, 2009 - 05:51:34 PM »
You do not need all of that!!!

3 gear planetary is fine.$126.88 for a 4 pinion is a rip off!!!
No Kolene steels
He is charging you Waaaaay too much if that does not include a converter. 
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #80 on: May 13, 2009 - 05:55:24 PM »
I see that includes a stock converter. He is about $300 too high.
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline shadango

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3920
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #81 on: May 13, 2009 - 06:11:16 PM »
Well, the last guy wanted  $550 just for a basic rebuild plus the rear servo, struts etc....by web prices that was about another $100 plus shipping...and then he wanted $180 for the shift kit.....there's almost $850 right there.

What does the 4 pinion front planetary and direct drum usually run?  My 3 pinion is bad so I guess he figures we will upgrade while he is changing that out.

Does the part number for the kit make sense?  Do you meant that the kit is more than I need? Or is it the steels you are referring to?

I had suggested/asked about going to kevlar clutches....so thats my fault,......but I figure its an upgrade, right?

In my experience with bike clutches, if the steels look good, you dont need to change them when you change clutch fibers, but many feel you do,,,maybe that is his theory here too as far as swapping in the Kolene steels?

So is he $300 high even considering the parts he is using or is he just $300 more than what I "need"?






« Last Edit: May 13, 2009 - 06:28:34 PM by shadango »

Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #82 on: May 13, 2009 - 06:29:16 PM »
This is what his parts should cost him:

Master with steels(OEM is all you need)  $70
intermediate band (OEM is all you need) $12
Transgo Kit $65-$75
Filter $1.50
bushing kit $25
direct drum $35
3 gear planet $25
stock converter  $45
billet rear servo  $15

$300 in parts (yes he has to mark them up, maybe $100-$150)
labor $300
total $750 for a BENCH JOB,for a $1000 he should be removing and installing it also.

The other guy was too high also. I wish I was closer so you could get a descent deal.
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline shadango

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3920
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #83 on: May 13, 2009 - 06:45:05 PM »
How much extra am I paying for the Kevlar clutches and Kolene steels and 4 pinion planetary?

Well, it could be a market difference too maybe as far as labor costs etc?  The guy down the street from me said to expect $800 or so.....and again, that was without hard parts......

I dunno.

Maybe you are just not charging enough.....LOL   :bigsmile:

I "could" go to see a guy that another guy I know had do his...a private individual...but then, I dont know them at all....and if things go bad, how can I have any recourse with a private individual?

I think I will have to just bite the bullet here....this shop knows I know this relative who recommeneded them and gives them work from his business...so I dont think they would try and shaft me.....

Wish you were closer too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That extra cahs would be nice to have for other stuff.....but.....without a tranny the car aint moving...LOL

Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #84 on: May 13, 2009 - 06:57:50 PM »
At least do this, get a price using a STOCK rebuild kit,and STOCK bands,billet rear servo,STOCK converter and a transgo kit. That is all you need.
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline barracuda7199

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 699
  • needs a resto but having to much fun right now
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #85 on: May 13, 2009 - 10:39:54 PM »
there is no way we could persuade you do attempt this on your own? you only need one special tool. and with 3 c clamps you can get around that! assuming you have a bushing and seal installing kit. but some sockets could be used there! go get your trans have tactransman send you the recommended kit then break out the snap ring pliers and maybe the digital camera if you get stuck and we can walk you thru this i promise!
Brandon

71 Barracuda 440 727                                                                 
(O O {]{]{]|[}[}[} O O)

Offline 71chally416

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3170
    • The Streetwalker
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #86 on: May 13, 2009 - 11:29:42 PM »
This is a 999 rebuild from a Cop car but they are pretty much the same as a 727. They even use the Transgo shift kit.  :2thumbs:

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/projectbuild/155_0404_1989_dodge_diplomat_transmission/index.html

Once we had Ronald Reagan, Bob Hope & Johnny Cash. Now we have Obama, No Hope and No Cash!

Offline shadango

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3920
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #87 on: May 14, 2009 - 05:53:15 AM »
Been stewing on this and after sleeping on it here is my thinking (sorry its a veeeeery long post)....

I am sure that if I looked long enough I could find a shop that would do it cheaper.  But its really just shooting in the dark....no shop is going to want to quote me a firm price without opening up the tranny and seeing what is going on for themselves.  How much is my time worth searching for a shop to save a couple hundred bucks?

This is why I asked around extensively before calling a shop.....unfortunately, all I can go by is word of mouth.....the first guy was recommended as was the second.....the first place just didn't feel right to me for some gut reason....mostly it was him charging me $180 for a $65 kit that started it and him not seeming to have the right answers for questions I had.....The fact that this second shop is about the same price but includes "better" bands, clutches and steels (even if I dont "need" them) makes me feel a little better.  Them being so similar in price tells me that while this may not be a "deal" of a price, it is probably indicative of the going rate in my neck of the woods for established tranny shops.  I paid $3k to get a rebuilt trammy for my 94 Ford Exploder while on vacation one year, so $1,000 feels like a discount....LOL :clapping:

I cant go in there and tell the guy how to build the thing, any more than I could come to your shop Terry and tell you....I can certainly ask questions and tell them what I think I want...for instance, the 3.8 lever.....this guy feels I wont need it with the other stuff he is doing but will put it in if I want. (I think I still want it...so where can I find one?) 

I have to trust you as the builder....and just like you shouldn't come down hard on the chef preparing your meal at a restaurant for obvious reasons , or try and take your own eggs an bacon to a restaurant and expect them to cook them up,  I don't think it would be a good idea to go to this guy and say "hey, some folks I trust online feel you are over-charging me by $300."...His response will be "Then have those folks rebuild your transmission.".......I could walk at this point and search again for a shop that can bet trusted that will charge me less....but the fact that this shop has already opened it up and would likely want "something" for the time they have into it now, which is only fair. So there goes any savings.

Really, tranny shops have the consumer by the balls...its a specialized trade that holds a certain amount of "magic" to it for most consumers.....understandably, they cant give you a definite price until they actualy start working on the unit to see whats inside.... you have to trust the shop, not only to do what they say they will do for the price they initially quote you but also that they are putting in what they say they are........I wont know whats in my tranny for sure now unless I open it up and tear it down after the fact .......

This shop knows I know the guy who feeds them a lot of business , so my thinking is that while they will certainly make a profit here, they aren't going to completely screw me, or at least that is what I am hoping.  They are also a national franchise......which probably means a higher price than the  little guy looking to get customers in a hard economy or a private individual doing work like this on the side.

So in the end, I am a bit at the mercy of this shop.  I accept that at this point.  I need my tranny redone and don't feel confident in doing it myself...I have enough learning going on with the rest of my car.  Maybe the next time around I will attempt redoing a tranny myself.....for now, I will cross my fingers, hope for the best and hope I don't end up singing "moon river"  (Fletch reference for those old enough to remember the film...LOL)

Thanks guys for looking out for me and having my back...the advice and insight gained here is invaluable!  :2thumbs:

I will keep everyone posted as this progresses...hopefully the rebuild goes smoothly and all I have to come back and ask is cooler and kickdown questions!  :bigsmile:

Offline tactransman

  • Sr. Resident
  • ******
  • Posts: 5401
  • 1973 Challenger- Member here since April 14, 2006
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #88 on: May 14, 2009 - 06:50:32 AM »
 :2thumbs:  The 3.8 lever is available from the Dodge Dealer part #2125067. If you need help after the install just ask away! :cheers:
Terry-tactransman 
Torqueflite/Automatic Transmission Specialist
Union, Mo.
Give a man a fish and he eats for a day,teach him to fish and he eats for a lifetime.

Offline shadango

  • Resident
  • *****
  • Posts: 3920
Re: Just got my used 727....now what?
« Reply #89 on: May 14, 2009 - 07:45:36 AM »
Thanks Terry.....I probably will! :bananasmi  :bigsmile:

So I can still get this thru the dealer....hadnt thought of that.

I may put a "want to buy" out there but will probably check dealer too then....