How low with leaf springs

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    Author Topic: How low with leaf springs  (Read 4974 times)

    Offline tomsa

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    How low with leaf springs
    « on: July 14, 2009 - 07:16:42 AM »
    I found out that the swedish rules for custom made cars going to give me a hard time with my planned 4-link rear end so I think I´m giving that up  :bricks1: :crying:

    But I still want my Challenger to be low with big tires so:
    • what leaf springs do you recomend?
    • wich rear hangers or slider?
    • front end hanger?
    • lowering blocks?

    I have to move the springs in about 3" so I guess that means using the boxes to relocate the spring

    Any ideas are welcome       (almost) :jumping:

    « Last Edit: July 14, 2009 - 07:18:52 AM by tomsa »
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    Offline Chryco Psycho

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #1 on: July 14, 2009 - 01:24:07 PM »
    Wel you can have springs made in any arc & stiffness you want ,
    Mancini has the conversion mount to move the front spring hanger into the frame rail & I believe it has 2 mount holes to adjust height , lowering blocks can be used as well but may not be nessisary
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    Challenger - You`ll wish You Hadn`t

    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #2 on: July 14, 2009 - 01:59:41 PM »
    I want it as low as at the pic

    I don´t know how much lower that is than stock but I guess at least 2" or more?
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    Offline 72bluNblu

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #3 on: July 14, 2009 - 03:47:10 PM »
    It doesn't look all that much lower than stock, 2" at the most. Challengers were pretty low in the back to begin with. My car is using stock Mopar XHD springs, with the 2 hole front hangers, but its set at normal ride height. Moving the front spring bolt to the other position would lower my car another 1" in the rear over where it is now, which should be pretty close to where yours is sitting in the picture. I would think that with regular old XHD's and the 2 position front hangers they sell you'd be pretty close to where you want to be. You could still put in a small lowering block if you had to.




    Also, just an FYI, with my 25.6"/26.7" tall front/rear tires, my header collectors sit about 3 1/2" off the pavement. Not sure if you plan on running headers, but if you are I wouldn't get much lower than that if you ever drive it on the street. And that's with the "good" headers, Hooker Super Comp 5115's. The "cheapies" would give even less ground clearance. Just a thought.
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    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #4 on: July 14, 2009 - 04:38:19 PM »
    Quote from: 72bluNblu on July 14, 2009 - 03:47:10 PM
    It doesn't look all that much lower than stock, 2" at the most. Challengers were pretty low in the back to begin with. My car is using stock Mopar XHD springs, with the 2 hole front hangers, but its set at normal ride height. Moving the front spring bolt to the other position would lower my car another 1" in the rear over where it is now, which should be pretty close to where yours is sitting in the picture. I would think that with regular old XHD's and the 2 position front hangers they sell you'd be pretty close to where you want to be. You could still put in a small lowering block if you had to.




    Also, just an FYI, with my 25.6"/26.7" tall front/rear tires, my header collectors sit about 3 1/2" off the pavement. Not sure if you plan on running headers, but if you are I wouldn't get much lower than that if you ever drive it on the street. And that's with the "good" headers, Hooker Super Comp 5115's. The "cheapies" would give even less ground clearance. Just a thought.

    That height looks close to what I´m looking for and if I can lower it with another inch it´s ok just in case
    Do you use stock rear hangers ?

    When I tested with an old leaf and put the front eye as close to the floor pan as I a could and the rear eye align to the rear hole in the frame I have ~3" between the rear axel and the leaf and if I lower the rear eye to where the hanger should be that 3" becomes about 5" instead thats why I thinking of sliders to get the rear eye closer the frame
    But that´s maybee not necessary ?
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    Offline 72bluNblu

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #5 on: July 14, 2009 - 05:17:43 PM »
    Yes, still using stock rear hangers too. Basically all stock on the rear suspension except for the XHD springs.

    Once the car is fully assembled and sitting on the suspension I think you'll find it'll be fine, the springs compress quite a bit with the weight of the car. I don't think you'll need to move the rear spring eye at all. Not sure about how the 3" inboard spring relocation goes, but it shouldn't change the ride height. And you can still probably move the front spring eye closer the the floor pan with an additional, higher hole for the eye bolt if there isn't one there already.
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    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #6 on: July 14, 2009 - 07:18:53 PM »
    Quote from: 72bluNblu on July 14, 2009 - 05:17:43 PM
    Yes, still using stock rear hangers too. Basically all stock on the rear suspension except for the XHD springs.

    Once the car is fully assembled and sitting on the suspension I think you'll find it'll be fine, the springs compress quite a bit with the weight of the car. I don't think you'll need to move the rear spring eye at all. Not sure about how the 3" inboard spring relocation goes, but it shouldn't change the ride height. And you can still probably move the front spring eye closer the the floor pan with an additional, higher hole for the eye bolt if there isn't one there already.
    The 3" inboard spring relocation is both at the front end and at the rear end otherwise the leaf goes into the tire but that as you say that can´t change the ride height

    But are these slider any good for street use?
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    Offline 72bluNblu

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #7 on: July 14, 2009 - 07:56:42 PM »
    By sliders I assume you mean something like this right?



    I've heard people running them on the street, only down side I've heard of is that they're noisy. They also attach to the bottom of the frame rail, so I really don't think you'd see much in terms of lowering because of them.
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    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #8 on: July 15, 2009 - 04:22:06 AM »
    Quote from: 72bluNblu on July 14, 2009 - 07:56:42 PM
    By sliders I assume you mean something like this right?



    I've heard people running them on the street, only down side I've heard of is that they're noisy. They also attach to the bottom of the frame rail, so I really don't think you'd see much in terms of lowering because of them.


    Yes that´s the one I mean
    Hmm   you´re probebly right about the lowering part,cant be much if any at all when i think about it
    I can understand that they are noisier when they move around on roller bearings attached to the frame........must make a nice echo   :rofl:

    I guess I just move them inside at both ends and makes some extra holes in boxes like this ones  but I have to build my own because I moved the frame so these ones doesen't fit anymore (I have an old one in the garage)

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    Offline HP2

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #9 on: July 15, 2009 - 09:25:03 AM »
    Sliders will move the rear eye up an additional two inches. However, because of the arc of the spring, this only translates to .75-1 inch of drop at the axle. They also require periodic inspection as dirt, grim, and road muck can jam up the bearings used in them.

    In an installed position, the stock style XHD springs should compress down to about a 2 inch arc. Whether or not this is low enough for your set up I don't know. There are any number of specialized spring manufacturers that can make the same spec spring for rate in 1" or 0 arc heights as well.  Remember that there is a difference in free arch (unloaded) vs installed arch. A 5" free arch can install to a 1" position depending on the number of leaves and size of those leaves.

    The easiest thing to do is simply install the rear suspension in its stock mounting points and put lowering blocks in it. Whether or not this is the best method for your application, I do not know.
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    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #10 on: July 15, 2009 - 11:08:40 AM »
    Quote from: HP2 on July 15, 2009 - 09:25:03 AM
    Sliders will move the rear eye up an additional two inches. However, because of the arc of the spring, this only translates to .75-1 inch of drop at the axle. They also require periodic inspection as dirt, grim, and road muck can jam up the bearings used in them.

    In an installed position, the stock style XHD springs should compress down to about a 2 inch arc. Whether or not this is low enough for your set up I don't know. There are any number of specialized spring manufacturers that can make the same spec spring for rate in 1" or 0 arc heights as well.  Remember that there is a difference in free arch (unloaded) vs installed arch. A 5" free arch can install to a 1" position depending on the number of leaves and size of those leaves.

    The easiest thing to do is simply install the rear suspension in its stock mounting points and put lowering blocks in it. Whether or not this is the best method for your application, I do not know.

    Because of I already move the frame inside about 4" each side and shorten the rear axel I have no stock mounting points left that I can use but I will drill the holes at the same height as stock and add an additional hole to move the spring in front
    Probebly I make the same arrangement in the back because I have to rebuild the frame in that end to.
    But I skip the sliders

    thanks for all answer
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    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #11 on: July 18, 2009 - 01:52:48 PM »
    Quote from: 72bluNblu on July 14, 2009 - 03:47:10 PM
    It doesn't look all that much lower than stock, 2" at the most. Challengers were pretty low in the back to begin with. My car is using stock Mopar XHD springs, with the 2 hole front hangers, but its set at normal ride height. Moving the front spring bolt to the other position would lower my car another 1" in the rear over where it is now, which should be pretty close to where yours is sitting in the picture. I would think that with regular old XHD's and the 2 position front hangers they sell you'd be pretty close to where you want to be. You could still put in a small lowering block if you had to.



    XHD?
    Is that extra heavy duty?
    Summit has these ones and these ones which ones are we talking about?
    « Last Edit: July 18, 2009 - 01:55:12 PM by tomsa »
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    Offline 72bluNblu

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #12 on: July 18, 2009 - 02:33:26 PM »
    Quote from: tomsa on July 18, 2009 - 01:52:48 PM
    XHD?
    Is that extra heavy duty?
    Summit has these ones and these ones which ones are we talking about?


    Yes, extra heavy duty. The first link

    http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DCC-4452985/

    is correct for the springs I ordered. It looks like Summit is offering Summit brand lowering springs for the Challenger though, see here..

    http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-7074CH-2/

    It also appears they are now offering stock height springs as well! Of course, I have NO idea how much lower the "lowering" springs would be, or if the stock ones are really the same height. They show them as being 57" 5 spring pack springs.

    It might be worth a try... :dunno:

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    Offline tomsa

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #13 on: July 18, 2009 - 03:57:46 PM »
    Quote from: 72bluNblu on July 18, 2009 - 02:33:26 PM
    Yes, extra heavy duty. The first link

    http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DCC-4452985/

    is correct for the springs I ordered. It looks like Summit is offering Summit brand lowering springs for the Challenger though, see here..

    http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-7074CH-2/

    It also appears they are now offering stock height springs as well! Of course, I have NO idea how much lower the "lowering" springs would be, or if the stock ones are really the same height. They show them as being 57" 5 spring pack springs.

    It might be worth a try... :dunno:


    They lower 2" (checked under application) I haven´t seen them when I search so that´s interesting
    I have to mail them or take I live chat on monday (calling usa is not cheap from sweden)
    Thankx
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    Offline HP2

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    Re: How low with leaf springs
    « Reply #14 on: July 19, 2009 - 02:17:57 PM »
    So  the next question would be what rate are they and how does that fit in to your suspension plan. opar does offer 0 and 1 inch arch oveal track springs, which are 120# rate. The factory XHD springs are between 140 and 150# with around a 2-2.5 arch. Super stock springs are around 160# rate with a 4-5 inch arch.

    Just to take a stab at it, I'd say Summit lowering springs are a zero arch, 140# rate. No guarantees of that until you can get a set in hand and check them.
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