Hey I got a crazy idea this past weekend...

[pink panther]

Jeff, you obviously have a generalized "fanatsy" (good word here) for cars, but you obviously don't possess a loyality to Mopars. To each his own I guess, all I know is that when I have a Mopar (7) I don't need or desire anything else.    

Not that I'm right and your wrong, or your right and I'm wrong............just an observation.  It's like being married I guess, hell yes I like looking at hotties of all ages (legal ages  ) , but my desire and loyality is to my lovely wife Pam. 

Nice save Jim.

[HP2]

Well, I hoped to bring up some points of consideration outside of the whole "its not a mopar"  or " how can you afford it" type of thing. If it actually helped you think of some other options or considerations, Cool!

I have NOOOOOOO interest in any old car besides a 'Cuda.  I don't want a Camaro or a Nova or anything like that. 

Ouch. Not liking old cars greatly narrows the possible options for a build up. Perhaps it will help us all by defining what you mean when you say you want to "build" a car. To a lot of guys here, building a car is taking an old car, disassembling it, and putting it back together to new, like, new, or better than new condition. To some building a car is cutting it into pieces and putting them back together in a different configuration, like changing to a four link rear, adding wheel tubs and roll cages. To others it could mean taking a basic frame or body, completely disecting it and designing everything that goes in to it from scratch. Where in this range do you think you fall when you say you want to build a car? 

When I bought my 'Cuda, I hoped that my dad would support me because of the fact that the purchase was inspired by him.  He really couldn't have cared less, and basically suggested I get rid of it the day after I bought it.  It was only because I enjoyed working on it and driving it that I decided I was indeed a 'Cuda fan myself and decided to stay the course.  So if I get another muscle car, it'll be another round-taillight 'Cuda.  But I'm going to buy one that is structurally sound and only needs minor mechanical work.  I'd still like to build my own 440 and install it, but I'm not really looking to "BUILD" a musclecar.

Ouch again. That has to sting to get that kind of response from your Dad. But, you did become a fan of the car and have the option of rejoining the ranks again, and may do so. But again, what do you mean when you say build? Building just an engine is a skill that some guys spend a lifetime mastering.

YES - I have torn apart cars and put them back together again. 

NO - I do not yet have the place to work on such a car - thus why I'm not buying it tomorrow! 

YES - I have tools.  I

YES - I have skills. 

Cool. Sounds like you have the basics covered.  You have what it would take to get through taking a car apart, fixing all the problems, and putting one back together.  I hate to harp on it, but again with the build question. Do you have design experience, machining back ground or other hard skills to get to the nitty gritty of building from scratch?

OH - and by the way, there IS a company that has ALREADY produced a kit that converts the back of the 5.7 and 6.1 HEMI's with a Porsche Transmission.  Trust me - I was just as shocked as you might be, but here's the link to prove that I found it already!

http://www.kennedyeng.com/vw_por.htm

Okay, I'm shocked! Holy, freaking, cow! The options this opens up for mid engined builds is staggering. Way Cool!!!

However, even with this, you are painting yourself into a somewhat difficult corner. You don't necessarily like old cars, check. You don't necessarily like body work, check. You don't want a kit that is a copy of something else, check. Hmmm, options are rapidly getting eliminated. Does it have to be a street car? Would you consider a competition on build? If it is a street car, have you considered the hurdles you may have with registration, licensing, and insurance? I know where I live, the DMV will register a kit car as a model it most closely resembles. That is easy if your building a '32 Ford because federal requirements for impact, safety and emissions were non-existant. However, build a super car looking thing that that in any way can be construed as a modern car and the list of regulations you have to meet may suddenly become exhaustively long. A good example is how tough it can be to get a kit car registered is in California. It can be done, but it is not easy.


G-man, ease up a little bit. I'm am very sorry to hear that you have now lost your latest aquisition to restoration/rebuild jail. That is a major drag and I wish you the best in getting them both done and back in your hands. However, Jeff is just thinking out loud and solicting opinions. This is no different than the many public posts and private emails you sent out asking about 500 horse, 20 mpg Hemis, viper handling suspension comparisons, or transmission selections.  He is bouncing it off the forum to bring out considerations he may not have taken in to account. This is a smart thing to do in comparison to buying the thing and then coming on here asking how do I figure out how to do the body work.


Sorry to divert the discussion. I now return you to the Sarah Palin tangent...

Speaking of hot gals, anyone watch Robin Mead on CNN?   

[73Chally]

Jeff, you did open the door on the financial aspect of the car yourself in your first post, where you made it sound like you're ready to drop the $40K tomorrow for it.  If you did not want your current financial situation to be drawn into it, you should have left any price references out of it. 

[whitesatinmopar]

Speaking of hot gals, anyone watch Robin Mead on CNN?   

Ohhhhhh yeah    Me thinks shes a lil tease too. You'd watch her last night, or was that this morning. ??  She will hold your attention for sure. 

[Super Blue 72]

On the new hundred dollar bill the time on the clock tower of Independence Hall is 4:10.

But what time is it on the clock tower when lightning hits in "Back to the Future"? 

[MEK-Dangerfield]

But what time is it on the clock tower when lightning hits in "Back to the Future"? 

Wasn't it 10 til midnight??     Oh gosh, I should know this one!!   

[hebeegbz]

I only watch Robin Mead for the news . My wife asked me why i watch with no sound and my response was  im a loyal republican . a tid bit she was the same hot chick on speed news a couple years back .

[go-fish]

I like the hotties on FOX News. Meagan Kelly, WOW. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1MxFDyaT08

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXZ_tfhGwaI

[ViperMan]

Thanks guys.  I'm actually rather insulted that you guys seem to think that the "off topic" forum still has to refer to "Mopar" vehicles or else you're going to fill it with crap about a stupid Alaskan bimbo who chickened out of her position as Governor because "the media kept making fun of her."

Tell ya what - she SURE would have been a great choice for Vice President, wouldn't she have?!?!

You're all right though.  I am certainly NOT a Mopar fan.  I mean, after all, I ONLY have a 2001 Dodge Stratus, a 2000 Dodge Viper, and owned a 1973 Barracuda.  My family in it's past has owned a Jeep Wrangler, a Dodge Dart, a Plymouth Cuda, a Dodge Durango, a Dodge Dakota, and currently my parents own a Sebring Convertible and a Jeep Grand Cherokee.  Oh and I gave up a Store Manager position for Goodyear Tire & Rubber company to be a service advisor at Brenner Chrysler Jeep because, well, I certainly don't like Mopar.  My first car-related job EVER was as a lot detailer at Milton Ruben Chrysler Plymouth Jeep Eagle in Augusta Georgia.  I drove Dad's 'Cuda to work and saw my first Viper in person there in 1997.  I guess by now you can tell that I'm actually a FORD loyalist, right?

HP2 - again you ask the kinda questions I need to be confronted with and I appreciate your insight.

Yes, "build" a car is about as precise a term as the word "rice"... 

In this particular case, I only refer to building in the realm of "building a kit car."  That is to take a bunch of big-boy lego pieces and after years of work and a bunch of money, having a car that I can drive out of the garage and zip down the road with the wife.

See, I'd "build" a muscle car, (like, I dunno - maybe a 'Cuda, but again - I don't like Mopars that much...) but first, the body would have to be in great shape, and second, I'd only want to start with the car already assembled, so that I can properly document and track the disassembly of pieces to make sure everything goes back where it should.  Old cars are SO much different than new cars, and the new cars are what I'm more familiar with - even though I worked at a restoration shop a few years ago.  Also, a kit car comes with an instruction manual!  (The GTM has a 600-page manual.)  Such detailed instructions don't exist for an old 'Cuda!  Granted I could pick Chrycho's brain any time I needed, but I'm sure I'd become a burden real quick!

And so yes - you're right.  My options are limited.  I want a unique vehicle - not a copy - that I can construct/assemble/"build" from the ground up.  To me it just seems like the ultimate automotive challenge, and as one article put it, not a lot of people can walk up to a car and go "see that?  I BUILT it..."  So far I found the Rossian Q1 - $100,000, the K1 Attack - $100,000, Nobles, which will run at least $80,000, and of course the FFR GTM, $40,000(+).

And BTW the discussion about registering/titling the car is kinda moot in my opinion.  I mean, if getting a kit car registered is "too hard" to deal with, than one certainly wouldn't have the ambition to actually build the car, now would they?!

I think I'm going to sit on this idea for 5 years or so, and see how things look then.  Obviously my body work budget is going to be much higher than I expected - probably twice.  I flat can't do it myself - I won't even try with fiberglass panels - so I'm going to have to make sure I can afford it.

Guys, I have BLED "Cuda-Challenger.com" for over two years now.  How any of you can tell me that my posts don't belong on this board and that I'm not a Mopar Enthusiast...  ...I'm honestly offended.  I left Carlisle this past July with tears in my eyes after selling my 'Cuda.  I dare any of you to say to my face that it didn't mean something to me.

I just... ...I'm speechless.

 

[Stacked440]

To each his own is my motto

[jeryst]

I know how you feel about the kit car Jeff. Like I said, I also wanted to do that about 20 years ago. A couple of things I'd like to point out.

 I dont know how it is today, but back then, a finished kit car was worth quite a bit. Why? Because, if you think about it, a kit car is really just a clone of some exotic car. If a Countach cost $250k new, then spending $60k to build a clone was justifiable. And there was a ready market, because a lot of people were willing to buy the clone because they couldnt afford the real thing, and they didnt want to invest that much of their own time and sweat. Not much different from today where someone is willing to spend $70k on a Hemi Cuda clone because they dont have the money for the real thing. The big difference, is that with a Cuda, you can get a low value car and clone it into a high value car. With an exotic, there are no base models to clone up, so that's the place that the kit cars fill.

As far as authenticity or reality, when you are cruising by at 40mph or more, most people who see the car will not know its a replica, unless they know you, or they know really a lot about the original. Depending on how detail oriented you are, even when you are sitting at a car event it may be hard to tell that the car is a kit. Some of the finished kit cars I looked at were authentic right down to the smallest details like the emblems and keys. It wasnt until you looked at the drivetrain that you realized it was a replica

I really gave up on the idea when I started talking to the guys that built the cars, and found out just exactly how much time, money, and labor was involved. The common thread seemed to be that nothing ever fit right, regardless of who made the kit. Although the exterior of the cars was usually very nice ( after many hours of fitting, trimming, filling, sanding, etc), people tended to skimp on the interiors because you just dont see that when the car drives by. Also, because of all of the custom fabrication involved, the cars seemed to have a lot of mechanical difficulties, and failing parts. And if a custom part fails, guess what? You gotta make another part. You dont have the luxury of running down to the local auto parts store. And even if you do go to the auto parts store for something, keeping track of what you have and what you need gets to be a big hassle. "Let's see, the rearend is from a 72 Porsche, and the motor is from a 68 Chrysler, and the suspension is from a 58 Ford, and" .... well, you know. Again, that was 20 years ago, so things may have improved since then.

In the end, it just seemed like it was not worth the hassle to build one. But, if I ran across a well crafted Countach replica for a decent price, would I buy it? Sure.

[wiiildcat]

        I think it's a matter of what you want to do. I'm not a kit car fan nor a hater. I think the car would be pretty slick when it's done if it is as advertised.
          Here is where I get slammed lol, I think you cant compare building a kit like the one you picked to resto modding a cuda. The kit cars I dont like are the ones that look exotic and have VW chassis and drive trains.
      If resale was a factor then I wouldnt even think about it. But if it was just to have fun and see what I could do, and I had the resource's Id do one in a heart beat. And Im one of the guys that dont care what the car show guys think lol, I got a 100% numbers matching 69 RS/Z-28, and I chromed almost every thing under the hood, trans too lol, talk about ticking purist off at shows, but thats more fun than driving it
 

[hebeegbz]

Thanks guys.  I'm actually rather insulted that you guys seem to think that the "off topic" forum still has to refer to "Mopar" vehicles or else you're going to fill it with crap about a stupid Alaskan bimbo who chickened out of her position as Governor because "the media kept making fun of her."

Tell ya what - she SURE would have been a great choice for Vice President, wouldn't she have?!?!

You're all right though.  I am certainly NOT a Mopar fan.  I mean, after all, I ONLY have a 2001 Dodge Stratus, a 2000 Dodge Viper, and owned a 1973 Barracuda.  My family in it's past has owned a Jeep Wrangler, a Dodge Dart, a Plymouth Cuda, a Dodge Durango, a Dodge Dakota, and currently my parents own a Sebring Convertible and a Jeep Grand Cherokee.  Oh and I gave up a Store Manager position for Goodyear Tire & Rubber company to be a service advisor at Brenner Chrysler Jeep because, well, I certainly don't like Mopar.  My first car-related job EVER was as a lot detailer at Milton Ruben Chrysler Plymouth Jeep Eagle in Augusta Georgia.  I drove Dad's 'Cuda to work and saw my first Viper in person there in 1997.  I guess by now you can tell that I'm actually a FORD loyalist, right?

HP2 - again you ask the kinda questions I need to be confronted with and I appreciate your insight.

Yes, "build" a car is about as precise a term as the word "rice"... 

In this particular case, I only refer to building in the realm of "building a kit car."  That is to take a bunch of big-boy lego pieces and after years of work and a bunch of money, having a car that I can drive out of the garage and zip down the road with the wife.

See, I'd "build" a muscle car, (like, I dunno - maybe a 'Cuda, but again - I don't like Mopars that much...) but first, the body would have to be in great shape, and second, I'd only want to start with the car already assembled, so that I can properly document and track the disassembly of pieces to make sure everything goes back where it should.  Old cars are SO much different than new cars, and the new cars are what I'm more familiar with - even though I worked at a restoration shop a few years ago.  Also, a kit car comes with an instruction manual!  (The GTM has a 600-page manual.)  Such detailed instructions don't exist for an old 'Cuda!  Granted I could pick Chrycho's brain any time I needed, but I'm sure I'd become a burden real quick!

And so yes - you're right.  My options are limited.  I want a unique vehicle - not a copy - that I can construct/assemble/"build" from the ground up.  To me it just seems like the ultimate automotive challenge, and as one article put it, not a lot of people can walk up to a car and go "see that?  I BUILT it..."  So far I found the Rossian Q1 - $100,000, the K1 Attack - $100,000, Nobles, which will run at least $80,000, and of course the FFR GTM, $40,000(+).

And BTW the discussion about registering/titling the car is kinda moot in my opinion.  I mean, if getting a kit car registered is "too hard" to deal with, than one certainly wouldn't have the ambition to actually build the car, now would they?!

I think I'm going to sit on this idea for 5 years or so, and see how things look then.  Obviously my body work budget is going to be much higher than I expected - probably twice.  I flat can't do it myself - I won't even try with fiberglass panels - so I'm going to have to make sure I can afford it.

Guys, I have BLED "Cuda-Challenger.com" for over two years now.  How any of you can tell me that my posts don't belong on this board and that I'm not a Mopar Enthusiast...  ...I'm honestly offended.  I left Carlisle this past July with tears in my eyes after selling my 'Cuda.  I dare any of you to say to my face that it didn't mean something to me.

I just... ...I'm speechless.

 

I tend to think Sarah Palin the so called bimbo has garnered more respect here than you ,could that be whats eating at ya .If you would embrace her thoughts and values just think how far ahead you would be, financially stable pay your bills before buying toys and a solid foundation to build your future from . so whos the bimbo. me thinks u

[hebeegbz]

to have a cuda in the pastense is kinda like the whole john bobit thing .

[ViperMan]

I tend to think Sarah Palin the so called bimbo has garnered more respect here than you ,could that be whats eating at ya .If you would embrace her thoughts and values just think how far ahead you would be, financially stable pay your bills before buying toys and a solid foundation to build your future from . so whos the bimbo. me thinks u

Wow.  I don't know who you are, but "me thinks u" are probably 18 to 22 years old and don't even HAVE a collector's car of any kind.  You talk like an idiot, so be aware that your opinion means exactly to me.

Yes - I should have Sarah Palin's ideals.  That's a great idea.  I'll start a 4-year project like this and then two years later get all sad because some guys on a car website made fun of me so I'll quit (while making a completely unintelligible speech on my way out.)

I mean, what planet are you from, anyways?  She's a quitter.  A crying, whining, brainless quitter.  The only thing I could possibly learn from her are things my parents taught me since I was five.  ONE) Sticks and stones can break your bones but words will never hurt you.  TWO) If at first you don't succeed, try, try and try again.

heebeegbz, I'm trying to engage in serious conversation on a serious topic with the adults of this forum.  I would suggest you visit the Dodge Neon boards with your childish comments.

Jeff