Rear suspension cock-eyed

[73Chally]

   Air shocks can ruin the cross member, they give a bad ride if pumped up much.

Not mine.  I guess I'm just lucky? 

[shadango]

I was just thinking that since I do need to replace my shocks, AND I have a little sag on the right I could kill two birds with one bazooka....LOL

Are Dusters/Darts setup differently as far as the cross member?  I seem to have run into seveeral folks with Dusters that love them......

Or maybe they just dont know the damage being done?

Bullit, what kind of damage can be done and under what conditions?

And 73chally....have you looked at your cross members lately to confirm that everything is ok?

[73Chally]

I just finished a nearly full restoration less than a year ago, and everything is great.  I did add a set of XHD springs about 2 years ago, so now I run the air shocks down near the bottom of their travel, with just enough air to pressurize them.  For the past 13 years, though, we had them aired up about half way.

[tommyg29]

I have air shocks too and no problems.
But, speaking of cock-eyed, I'm measuring for new wheels, and Ive noticed that the leaf springs have a larger gap to the front side of the tire than the rear. In other words, the rear leaf mounts are a couple inches wider than the fronts. Is this correct? I would think they should be parallel.

[HP2]

But, speaking of cock-eyed, I'm measuring for new wheels, and Ive noticed that the leaf springs have a larger gap to the front side of the tire than the rear. In other words, the rear leaf mounts are a couple inches wider than the fronts. Is this correct? I would think they should be parallel.

That is correct. E and F bodies have springs that are wider in the rear. E bodies are 1.67 degrees tapered and F bodies are .85 degrees tapered. Post 73 B bodies are the opposite and are .61 degrees wider in the front segment. This is done for handling purposes as it gives the springs more lateral stiffness as it begins to twist the springs more quickly during cornering than a parallel spring design will do.

[crcarch]

I'm running into a similar problem with the passenger side being about 3/4" too low.  The drivers side height is perfect. The car springs are new MP - HD stock springs (5-springs DS, 6-springs on the PS). Shocks are not yet installed. New .96" T-bars to hold up the yet-to-be-installed 440, but bars have almost no torque on them yet so the ride height can be level with only the body weight. The car sat low on the passenger side before restoration began, but I just attributed it to old springs and the fact that I'd ripped out the front PS spring mount one time during a juvenile display of torque and had the torque box patched up by a local body shop.

I can understand the T-bar adjustment making a difference if the opposite rear side is too high, but I can't picture it if it's too low. Especially if the other side is sitting properly.

Are these cars prone to being uneven from the factory?  I see no sign that my car was ever wrecked.  Is the best course to compensate for the 3/4" to reverse the front spring mount or add a leaf only on the PS or increasing the rear shackle length?

[Chryco Psycho]

the diagonally opposite T bar will have an effect on the rear leaf spring , back off the drivers T bar a little

[shadango]

I am adding add-a-leafs this morning...have the right side apart down to the center bolt being out....

Looking at the "foldover clamps" that align the spring leafs, how do you get this off? The manual says to remove and discard...using new ones...

How hard will it be to find new ones?  Looks like the old ones will break when I take them off...there is a little tab that folds into another part....its all rusty so I assume it will break...

ANy ideas?

[shadango]

Ok...so an update....

Decided that the wrap around clamps couldnt be used with the new add a leafs anyways....so got them off "by any means necessary".....they got pretty mangled.

I guess I will have to buy some aftermarket foldover clamps.....or are they really even critical?

The whole thing went back together easy enough.

I am still measuring off......right is lower by 3/4", just like you CRCARCH.

The drivers side went from 25" 1/2" as measured at the center of the fender well to (hold on to your hat)  29 1/2".

The right side went from 24 3/4" to 28 3/4".

That means that the right spring must not have been sagging more than the left I guess.....

I haven't had the car out...its snowing.....but like I said it is still sitting crooked. But I think my garage floor also makes it look worse than it is (slopes to the middle in the front).....

I tweaked the front left t bar a little more by a turn....each front fender well edge sits the same now...

The rear still measures different.

One thing is for sure....the rear end is certainly higher and it isnt sagging overall anymore.

Its a bit more jacked up than I was thinking though......not sure if I will like it or not.....the tires I have right now arent very high profile....I have room now for fatter tires as far as height if I wanted to do that.....LOL

I also think I have the clearance needed for the exhaust now to NOT hit the axle as it moves.....actually as think as that add-a-leaf is I am not sure how much the axle will move...LOL

My tries are "TOURING" tires (on there when I bought it) so the sidewalls arent as wide as regular tires...that is contributing to the gap above the tires looking large.....

I also noticed that the shocks, especially the left one, is nearing the end of its travel.....I can bounce the car up and down and if I push really hard I can get to the end of the travel on the left one....

LEFT


RiGHT


Now, I know it will settle a little ...plus it will go down some with load (me and passengers) in it....but am I risking a real headache?

This, I am really concerned about.....
I was expecting just an inch or two of lift from these based on what others ended up with.....so I hadn't been worrying about the shocks much, which I plan to replace anyways....but I am sure that whatever the replacement they will be the stock length.....

[the_engineers]

Wow...that's high.

Know that you're continuing to see the same lean, I think it's time to start measuring...

Are your rear tires the same size?  It looks like it, but be sure.

In both of the rear pics of the car, the right spring is definetely coming out at a flatter angle than the left.  I think your right spring is just weak or sagging.  If you added a helper spring to each side, you made them equally stronger, so it would stand to reason that your "lean" would continue.  You may have to break down and buy new springs...

Your exhaust on the right side appears to touch the valance; where there is a gap on the left side.  Is this an exhaust issue, or a panel issue, or worse?

[shadango]

Wow...that's high.

Know that you're continuing to see the same lean, I think it's time to start measuring...

Are your rear tires the same size?  It looks like it, but be sure.

In both of the rear pics of the car, the right spring is definetely coming out at a flatter angle than the left.  I think your right spring is just weak or sagging.  If you added a helper spring to each side, you made them equally stronger, so it would stand to reason that your "lean" would continue.  You may have to break down and buy new springs...

Your exhaust on the right side appears to touch the valance; where there is a gap on the left side.  Is this an exhaust issue, or a panel issue, or worse?

The tires are the same, fronts match each other as do the rears.

The exhaust on the right is crooked.....it was banging on that side against the axle due to clearances, mostly when carrying passengers...........part of which I contributed to spring sag.....the banging forced the end of the pipe up....so you get what it is the pic....I havent begin to address that yet.

The add a leaf is substantial....I figured that if one spring was sagging more than the other, the add a leaf would basically force the spring packs back into an arch that would be equal....to my eye, it sure seems like the springs are now about the same arch.....the add a leaf (very thick) spans from the center of each spring towards the ends...the parts of the original springs that extend past that add a leaf don't look to be sagging at all, let alone on one side more than the other.

I checked to be sure the front mounts were not flipped....they are both set up the same, the eye towards the bottom of the mount....

The picture is poor I suppose....plus I measured my garage floor....the area between the wheels in the rear is perfectly level.....the front, the floor slopes substantially.....by the time it get to the wheel its an inch or maybe a little more lower......It could be that THAT is causing the car to sit crooked.....

I have to wait til the snow stops and things dry up I guess before I can find some flat level area and then measure....all of my measuring has been the garage...

As for it being high, yeah....I guess it is.....In the garage at least though, I dont mind it......provided the shocks are going to be OK.

I have felt all along that the rear of the car sat too low...I like some lift....I sat in it after the install and it feels better to me from the drivers seat...although standing at the trunk it sure seams weird.....the measurement at the center of the rear bumper increased 5" !!!!

I guess the jury will still be out for a bit.

 

[wally426ci]

Shadango, that should settle down a little once you take a ride on a good old bumpy back road. I too am worried by the shocks though........

[shadango]

I am not as worried as if they were bottoming out I guess.....they are "topping out"....

There is about an inch of travel (quick guestimate) upwards before they top out....By the marks on the shock, it looks like the shock is extended about 2 inches over all more than they were.....(not sure how that measurement is less than the wheel well change.....Unless I bogusly mismeasured to begin with......)

With the stiffer ride I am sure I will have, the shocks may not move as much as they did before the add a leafs....plus, the "topping out" would affect only how much the axle can "drop".....seeing as I am not bajaing like in a 4x4 (where drop is extremely important) maybe I can get away with them the way they are?

A couple other folks here supposedly used the same exact part number and have had no shock issues....

Here's a thought....Maybe I dont have the right shocks on there to begin with?

[dodj]

In both of the rear pics of the car, the right spring is definetely coming out at a flatter angle than the left.

I checked to be sure the front mounts were not flipped....they are both set up the same, the eye towards the bottom of the mount....
/quote]
Are both front spring mounts level? Is it possible that one is angled somewhat. Are they both in the same relative position? I don't think it is likely, but maybe someone drilled different holes in the past to change the ride height? Are the rear shackles the same?..... I'm out of guesses now..

[Chryco Psycho]

the wrap clamps are not critical , I can get you new ones if you need , I use a square top U bolt instead , it clamps harder & helps traction