Hotchkis leaf springs

Author Topic: Hotchkis leaf springs  (Read 7626 times)

Offline ericindc

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Hotchkis leaf springs
« on: February 01, 2010 - 01:59:35 PM »

I was looking at the hotchkis springs but I am wondering how much better these actually are than the XHD Mopar springs, or lowered ESPO springs.  Are the Hotchkis springs really worth the 300 plus dollars more than the others?  How much better is the handling?
1974 Challenger, 440, auto, 17s
1983 Jeep CJ7, Chevy 350, auto, 32" tires, 2.5" lift




Offline boydsdodge

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2010 - 10:57:42 PM »
I have a set being delivered to my shop this week. I'll let you know what i think.
Jackson from Toronto.

Offline Road_Runner

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2010 - 11:29:06 PM »
I'd be curious about this myself.  Are you looking at just getting the rear leaf springs or the entire 'system' from Hotchkis?  Seems to me that the primary advantage is that by buying the package you get a scienced out setup as opposed to just buying springs from Mopar, front end parts from Moog, sway bars from PST, etc.  I don't have the time or money to try a bunch of different parts, so whatever I do I want it to work well when I'm done.  Maybe its not as hard as I'm making it sound, but I do think buying parts piecemeal opens one up to something less than optimal results.  Thoughts?

Thanks, Jim
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Offline HP2

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2010 - 09:06:08 AM »
I'd say yes and no. If you buy an entire system, yes, it should be scienced out to be optimal. However, Hotchkis doesn't sell torsion bars to match their system, but does offer an adjustable rear sway bar. So they are not truly optimized when it comes to wheel rates, but do have a broader range of adjustment than others and they do improve on the geometric alignment of most things. By contrast, the XV L1 set up is optimized to work together, but does nothing to correct any geometry issues.

Buying parts piecemeal could lead to less than optimal results if you do not know how the system works together and how each piece impacts the other. On the  other hand, by knowing how it is all interelated, it is also possible to optimize the results beyond what anyone else out there is offering as a kit. It all depends on the goal and each persons personal knowledge. It isn't really difficult, there are entire books written on the subject, but it can be time consuming to find the best srouces and there can be a fair amount of analysis and mathmatics to sort it all out. 

In this regard suspension are no different than engines. When building an engine, you can either call up a builder give some specs and expectations, and have a bullet delivered. The other way you can research, discuss, model, pick and chose, and build one yourself. Depending on your skill, time, desire, and wallet,  you can either be very satisfied or sadly disappointed by either approach.

Offline Road_Runner

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2010 - 09:17:58 PM »
I'd say yes and no. If you buy an entire system, yes, it should be scienced out to be optimal. However, Hotchkis doesn't sell torsion bars to match their system, but does offer an adjustable rear sway bar. So they are not truly optimized when it comes to wheel rates, but do have a broader range of adjustment than others and they do improve on the geometric alignment of most things. By contrast, the XV L1 set up is optimized to work together, but does nothing to correct any geometry issues.

Buying parts piecemeal could lead to less than optimal results if you do not know how the system works together and how each piece impacts the other. On the  other hand, by knowing how it is all interelated, it is also possible to optimize the results beyond what anyone else out there is offering as a kit. It all depends on the goal and each persons personal knowledge. It isn't really difficult, there are entire books written on the subject, but it can be time consuming to find the best srouces and there can be a fair amount of analysis and mathmatics to sort it all out. 

In this regard suspension are no different than engines. When building an engine, you can either call up a builder give some specs and expectations, and have a bullet delivered. The other way you can research, discuss, model, pick and chose, and build one yourself. Depending on your skill, time, desire, and wallet,  you can either be very satisfied or sadly disappointed by either approach.

Good points, so a suggestion for a really good sticky thread similar to the E body tire combo one, is one for people who are finished with their setups & happy with the results to post what components they used and their observations of the results.  It would be interested to hear how the different mixture of springs, bushings, torsion bars, wheels & tires, etc. all contributed to the end result.

Thanks, Jim
1970 383 Roadrunner Tor Red
1973 318 Barracuda Mist Green
2014 Mustang GT/CS Convertible All Black

Offline boydsdodge

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2010 - 10:18:12 PM »
Good points, so a suggestion for a really good sticky thread similar to the E body tire combo one, is one for people who are finished with their setups & happy with the results to post what components they used and their observations of the results.  It would be interested to hear how the different mixture of springs, bushings, torsion bars, wheels & tires, etc. all contributed to the end result.

Thanks, Jim


I think thats a great idea.
Jackson from Toronto.

Offline inviolet

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2010 - 05:16:18 PM »
I have a set being delivered to my shop this week. I'll let you know what i think.

Did you every get the Hotchkis leaf springs in? Any one have any pictures of set?

Offline HP2

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2010 - 06:04:53 PM »
The only problem with posting suspension combos is that most everyone has an opinion of what they think is good handling, but very few have the means to quantify it to a relevent number.

For example, in stock 1970 form, a muscle car may be good for .6g. By comparison a modern sedan is going to be inthe upper .8g range. A number of companies are claiming high .9-1g performance. Were those number achived by 30 profile tires or a great combination of sway bar rates? What happened to ride quality in the process? How do those numbers translate to a highway on ramp performace or a run up the local twisty road?

Unless someone is using a g-tech or doing a stop watch timed skid pad exercise, it is all very subjective and there any any of several dozen ways to get there.

Offline autoxcuda

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2010 - 02:33:44 AM »

Unless someone is using a g-tech or doing a stop watch timed skid pad exercise, it is all very subjective and there any any of several dozen ways to get there.

When Hotchkis did their last test they did use a sophisticated G-Tech, timed skid pad, timed slalom, and had instantaneous speed around a road course recorded and verified through GPS. They really stressed not to pay attention to the raw numbers, but look and the improvements/changes in the numbers. They did the before and after on the same day, same car, and only changed what was part of thier kit. I watched them do it.
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Offline boydsdodge

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2010 - 11:03:35 PM »
Did you every get the Hotchkis leaf springs in? Any one have any pictures of set?

The springs are sitting at the shipping warehouse, but I am waiting on a few other items my customer ordered after.
as soon as I get them I'll let you know.
Jackson from Toronto.

Offline inviolet

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2010 - 09:31:56 AM »
Can someone running The Hotchkis leaf springs please post a picture. I'm curious to see how they are designed, and the final ride height.  The only car I've ever seen with these springs is there Challenger. I'd like to see a Cuda with a set. 

Offline boydsdodge

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2010 - 11:10:05 PM »
I got the springs in from the shipper today.
It's a good looking kit, I was pleasantly surprised to find springs, new front hangers with bolts, shackle bushings and bolts, and U bolts.
The springs are a three leaf design with thicker steel then the original or Mopar springs.
I have a brand new H/D spring here for an Ebody so I did a simple measurement comparison using my weight.
I am 160 Lbs, with me standing on the Mopar H/D spring I got a drop of 1 and 3/8th inch, then i stood on the the Hotchkis springs and got a drop of 1 inch.
I took a few pics with my phone but i have to get them loaded for you later.
The price seems high but after dealing with the guys at Hotchkis and them giving me a bit of a break on the price, (just ask them) I think it looks like a fair deal.
The only thing I was not liking was the U-bolts are not flat at the top of the arch like the factory peices.
I'll be using the new stock Chrysler U/bolts.
So If you take the cost of the Mopar parts, springs $250.00 , U-bolts $80.00, shackle bushings $15.00, front spring hanger from Mancini $70.00. and no new bolts. $415.00 is what i had into the new mopar setup.
I think I have the same into the Hotchkis but its a lighter stiffer flatter spring.
Just what I'd want for what i will be doing. No 1/4 mile for me.
Now all we have to do is see what it realy does for the car.
Hotchkis should say that they supply all the new hardware in there spring kit, it really was a nice surprise but I almost didnt go for it because I only thought I was only getting springs and hangers.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2010 - 11:14:09 PM by boydsdodge »
Jackson from Toronto.

Offline Road_Runner

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2010 - 11:26:03 PM »
I got the springs in from the shipper today.
It's a good looking kit, I was pleasantly surprised to find springs, new front hangers with bolts, shackle bushings and bolts, and U bolts.
The springs are a three leaf design with thicker steel then the original or Mopar springs.
I have a brand new H/D spring here for an Ebody so I did a simple measurement comparison using my weight.
I am 160 Lbs, with me standing on the Mopar H/D spring I got a drop of 1 and 3/8th inch, then i stood on the the Hotchkis springs and got a drop of 1 inch.
I took a few pics with my phone but i have to get them loaded for you later.
The price seems high but after dealing with the guys at Hotchkis and them giving me a bit of a break on the price, (just ask them) I think it looks like a fair deal.
The only thing I was not liking was the U-bolts are not flat at the top of the arch like the factory peices.
I'll be using the new stock Chrysler U/bolts.
So If you take the cost of the Mopar parts, springs $250.00 , U-bolts $80.00, shackle bushings $15.00, front spring hanger from Mancini $70.00. and no new bolts. $415.00 is what i had into the new mopar setup.
I think I have the same into the Hotchkis but its a lighter stiffer flatter spring.
Just what I'd want for what i will be doing. No 1/4 mile for me.
Now all we have to do is see what it realy does for the car.
Hotchkis should say that they supply all the new hardware in there spring kit, it really was a nice surprise but I almost didnt go for it because I only thought I was only getting springs and hangers.

I am very interested in either the Hotchkis or XV suspensions and really appreciate you sharing your experiences here.  I can't wait to see your pics of the car when you're done and your opinion on how the new springs helped your car handle.

Thanks, Jim
1970 383 Roadrunner Tor Red
1973 318 Barracuda Mist Green
2014 Mustang GT/CS Convertible All Black

Offline HP2

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2010 - 08:23:01 AM »
It sounds like the Hotchkis springs are very similar to the original mopar kit car springs; fewer, thicker leaves with a flatter arch.

My oval track springs have 4 leaves that a 9/16 thick compared to the XHDs that are 5.5 leafs that are 7/16 thick. They also have the shorter, SS style front segment.

Looking forward to your feedback this summer on how you like them. I'm hoping to finally hit the pavement with mine after several years of inactivity.

Offline inviolet

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Re: Hotchkis leaf springs
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2010 - 02:43:34 PM »
It sounds like the Hotchkis springs are very similar to the original mopar kit car springs; fewer, thicker leaves with a flatter arch.

My oval track springs have 4 leaves that a 9/16 thick compared to the XHDs that are 5.5 leafs that are 7/16 thick. They also have the shorter, SS style front segment.

Looking forward to your feedback this summer on how you like them. I'm hoping to finally hit the pavement with mine after several years of inactivity.


Hotchkis sounds good, but all I would need is the springs, not the rest of the kit. Currently I use a 1'inch offset shackle kit from Dr. Diff and a 69 charger rear because I run a wide tire. My front hangers are also setup for SS style front segment.

HP2 do these springs below sound like yours?

The springs that I'm currently using are:

Oval Track Leaf Spring — No Arch

Reissued Mopar Kit Car leaf springs are ideal for oval track
applications. These springs are widely used on dirt track race cars.
The spring rate is 120 lbs. per inch. Front 20.50", Rear 35.0". Note:
Legal restrictions may apply.

P4529414        Each             $95.00

The car sits nice and low, and handles pretty good but they look a little weak towards the front segment. Another weird thing is the rear looks like it's sitting a half inch to far back (its hard to tell but something looks off). Maybe the SS style offset hangers/front spring segment combination is causing this. So I'm debating whether to go with the Hotchkis springs or a set of Low Arched ESPO springs (5 or 6 leaf) and getting new standard length Dr. Diff 1'inch offset hangers to correct these 2 issues.


Here's a picture: