440 question : Can you get 450-500 hp and 500-600 fpt without a stroker kit

[torqueaddict]

Hey Guys I am new to this site and this is my first post. I wanna build a 440 that will put out between 450-500 hp and between 500-600 fpt while running pumped gas. My first question is do I have to stroke my motor accomplish this? The pieces I have already are : 78 440 block (standard bore), stealth 440 source heads fresh out the box, stock 440 rods, and a  stock 440 crank (forged, not the blocks original). I would prefer to not stroke it (cost is an issue),is what I wanna do just wishful thinking or can it be accomplished? Guys any help will be greatly appreciated, Thanks in advance.

[72bluNblu]

You're joking right? 

1 horse per cube is fairly easy to do with a modern rebuild (notice, I did not say "cheap"), even without aftermarket heads. According to 440 source their heads will support over 550 hp out of the box, so that shouldn't be a problem. Get your compression up to 10:1, with aluminum heads you might be able to run it up a little higher and still run pump gas. Then get a strong cam, newer aftermarket intake, and headers. The cam selection will be the big deciding factor, for 450 hp you really shouldn't even need that radical of a cam. 500 hp is very do able with a stock stroke 440.

I'm not a big block guy, so I'm sure others will have more specifics. How do I know that the numbers you want can be that easily achieved? These are the specs of 2 different 360 builds, both of which put out over 450 hp and should run on pump gas. Complete page is here, it lists 9 360 builds with dyno results, just for thought http://www.mopar1.us/dyno.html .

Package eight:
360 rebuilt with 9.5 to 1 cast pistons, original crank, rods and windage tray.  202 heads with competition valve job and ported to flow 260 cfm.  Edelbrock RPM intake, Holley 750 rejetted, Large tube headers and Mopar Performance P4120231 cam with .484" lift, 284 duration, 108 lsa, installed at 106 intake centerline.
460 h.p. @6000 rpm
486 lbs. of torque @ 4,250 rpm

Package nine:
360 rebuilt with 10:1 compression flat top cast pistons, original crank turned .010"/.010", rebuilt factory rods.  Factory windage tray installed. 2.02" heads with competition valve job and ported to flow 260 cfm.  Edelbrock RPM intake, port/gasket matched. Holley H.P. 750 (.076" front, .080" rear jets).  Large 1 3/4" primary tube headers.  Comp Cams 305AH-8 camshaft with .525"/.540" lift and 305/312 degree advertised duration, 253/260 degrees @ .050", 110 lsa, installed at 108 intake centerline.  This motor is a brute for a street car and would only be considered a weekend blaster.
495 h.p. @ 6,000 rpm
500 lbs. of torque @ 4,500 rpm

You'll notice "package 9" is a 360 that meets all of your criteria. Not very street friendly because of the cam, but, its still a naturally aspirated, non-stroker engine that's short 80 cubic inches and still meets your goals.

[Cooter]

Sh*t, You can get that kind of power out of a 440 with a simple intake, Cam, heads, header swap and piston swap....

550 HP 440's are all around you..Check a search here and I'm sure You will find a tasty recipe for a nasty little 440...

[The Cuda Guy]

Hey Guys I am new to this site and this is my first post. I wanna build a 440 that will put out between 450-500 hp and between 500-600 fpt while running pumped gas. My first question is do I have to stroke my motor accomplish this? The pieces I have already are : 78 440 block (standard bore), stealth 440 source heads fresh out the box, stock 440 rods, and a  stock 440 crank (forged, not the blocks original). I would prefer to not stroke it (cost is an issue),is what I wanna do just wishful thinking or can it be accomplished? Guys any help will be greatly appreciated, Thanks in advance.

500hp and 600tq is a very more realelistic goal with those heads.

- 10.5:1 comp ratio
- Solid Cam (2500-5500 rpm range)
- Alum Intake
- 850 Carb
- Headers
- 3 inch exhaust
- High Flow Muffs

This should put you about where you want to be.  Keep in mind I only base this off of what I have read not what I know first hand.  Good luck.   

Don

[BB73Challenger]

You mention the rods but not the pistons...

I hate to play devil's advocate but if you need to spring for new pistons you are well on your way to just buying a stroker kit 

But I would agree that with your good heads, and good bump stick and plenty of flow in and out 500 should be no problem.

I always hear Chryco mention watch your comp ratio with alum heads, I think they do want more comp as 72blunblu said

[Roppa440]

Static compression ratio has little bearing on cylinder pressure. With alloy heads shoot for at least 10.5:1 for use with premium fuel. You can go higher than that and just use a bigger cam to bleed off pressure. In fact I would shoot for 11:1 and use something like my cam which is the smallest Hughes Engines solid lifter cam and you will make well over 500hp with the stock stroke with plenty of bottom end torque.

[aris_unlimited]

I was talking to an engine builder around here, wanting the same goals. While it is possible to get those numbers without stroking the motor out, he said it'd be easier to get them making it a stroker. I said ok lol. Figure he is the one in the know, and he is only charging $5k to do my motor so....

[torqueaddict]

Guys a;; this feedback is really helpful. Idont have pistons yet so I know I need those. If I absolutely have to I will get  stroker kit I would just like to avoid it for cost reasons, and I just hear when it comes to putting 100K on a motor stay as close to factory as possible. Also I figure no stroker kit, and I save like $1500 smackers.

[HP2]

Well, what is a stroker kit, $1500 to $1800 or so?

By comparison;
main bearings $80
rod bearings  $65
ARP rod bolts  $60
ARP main bolts $60
resize rods  $100
grind crank   $125
new forged pistons  $400
rings $95
total of $985, so just shy of a grand.  So, for $500 more, you can move from a 446 to a 496 or increase displacement by 50 extra cubic inches for only around $10 an inch.

Also factor in that these long stroke kits makes massive amounts of HP and torque at reasonable rpm ranges and Now you can see why strokerers are so popular.

[The Cuda Guy]

$1450.00


http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/493440flpist.html

[torqueaddict]

Thanks cuda guy and hp2 I was actually thinking of going with the Mancini  kit after reading hp2's post. What kind of hp and torque will that kit give me? If I  am gonna stroke the block I expect a little more like 500 hp and torque available at the wheels if I do the rest of the combo  correctly

[Moparal]

 and I just hear when it comes to putting 100K on a motor stay as close to factory as possible. Also I figure no stroker kit, and I save like $1500 smackers


I do not believe you will see 100k miles on a stroker 600 hp engine.  I can see years of local driving and a few spurts at the track tho.   And if you use steel heads, you are about finished at 6k with gobs of bottom end tq.  If yer looking for more horse power and tq, it always takes major head work on steel heads, or after market heads with at least cnc porting. Stroker kits don't absolutely mean you are gaining horse power or for that matter hundreds of hp. The whole combo has to be matched. 550 hp is easy with a stroker and steel heads for pump gas,  with a good tune, after that, you have to earn it in the tune. It doesnt come easy.

[torqueaddict]

Wise words moparal, are you saying the aluminum heads will hurt my build tho. And I didnt really mean 100k miles just really durable unless I dont take care of it

[Moparal]

Oh contrare, Aluminum heads would be benificial for you for both pump gas, flow, and compression. They just add dollars to a build is all.  You can chieve all you are asking with steel. Out the box aluminum Stealth heads flow as good as ported 906 steel heads.  They are all new and inexpensive is an alternative also

[torqueaddict]

I had a set of 906 heads rebuilt from a previous build it was about the cost of the stealth heads. I just went ahead and got them. When I did the math it only made sense to pick them up. Since those are already in the build, I'm primarily concerned with the bottom end. Whose stroker kit is better Mancini or 440source. That's good to know about iron heads tho  I appreciate all info I am a mopar sponge!!!