Going to larger torision bars will this raise the car.

[Kevin71]

  I like the way the cars used to sit with air shocks.  Jacked up a little bit.  But it has such a negative effective on handling my thoughts were just leave the rear stock and lower the front some.  Car should handle a little better and give me the same look.  I have a .92 torrision bars now.  I adjusted them all the way down until  the adjusters were not touching and then raised it a inch.  It's bottoming out pretty bad.  Also the sway bar is 1 1/8 inch.   There is no rear sway bar.  It's also got a 440 which is out right now getting rebuilt.  So I wanted to rebuild the front end while the engine is out.  I have read where some people have gone to the thicker torrision bars and the car set higher.  So my concern was if I went to a 1 inch bar I would have trouble getting the front down.  There is currently about 5 inches of ground clearence at the k frame.  I have new leaf springs on the rear that are heavy duty but the car still sits pretty low on the rear.  They settled about a inch I would guess.  I have considered getting a set that raise the rear 2 inches and after it settles it would be about 1 to 1 1/2 higher.  Magnum force tells me if I go with the 2" drop spindle I will have to change the breaks.   I don't know if the car came with disc or drum but it has SSBC 10 1/2 disc on the front and drums in the rear.  I want to disc on the rear as I just wouldn't have to adjust them and it currently doesn't have a parking brake.  SSBC says it will not bolt onto the drop spindles.  That they are based on the 73 and up disc spindles and my current brackets are based on the drum spindle pre 73.  Says they can't just sell me bracket, would have to buy new setup.  I have planned on going to poly bushings and MOOG joints with a adjustable upper control arm from magnum force.  Also Bilstein shocks with a 7/8 rear sway bar.  I would like for it to handle a little better but also would like that raked look.   This has been giving me fitts trying to figure out what to do.  Any advice is appreciated.

[brads70]

I have 1" t-bars from Just suspension, I think they are on sale now? $200? I adjusted mine till I had 25" from the center of the front wheel opening to the ground. I have no idea about SSBC brakes? Bigger rotors are always an advantage braking wise? Sounds like you want the same look as I do in the back.  Read through this post, saves me from typing out what I did. I went from a horriblly bad push in the corners to slightly loose in the back end when I power through the corners. Just how I like it! 

http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=73985.0

[Strawdawg]

 I went from a horriblly bad push in the corners to slightly loose in the back end when I power through the corners. Just how I like it! 

http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=73985.0

Brad, you could have bought an old Porsche for less if that is what you like! 

[Strawdawg]

  I like the way the cars used to sit with air shocks.  Jacked up a little bit.  But it has such a negative effective on handling my thoughts were just leave the rear stock and lower the front some.  Car should handle a little better and give me the same look.  I have a .92 torrision bars now.  I adjusted them all the way down until  the adjusters were not touching and then raised it a inch.  It's bottoming out pretty bad.  Also the sway bar is 1 1/8 inch.   There is no rear sway bar.  It's also got a 440 which is out right now getting rebuilt.  So I wanted to rebuild the front end while the engine is out.  I have read where some people have gone to the thicker torrision bars and the car set higher.  So my concern was if I went to a 1 inch bar I would have trouble getting the front down.  There is currently about 5 inches of ground clearence at the k frame.  I have new leaf springs on the rear that are heavy duty but the car still sits pretty low on the rear.  They settled about a inch I would guess.  I have considered getting a set that raise the rear 2 inches and after it settles it would be about 1 to 1 1/2 higher.  Magnum force tells me if I go with the 2" drop spindle I will have to change the breaks.   I don't know if the car came with disc or drum but it has SSBC 10 1/2 disc on the front and drums in the rear.  I want to disc on the rear as I just wouldn't have to adjust them and it currently doesn't have a parking brake.  SSBC says it will not bolt onto the drop spindles.  That they are based on the 73 and up disc spindles and my current brackets are based on the drum spindle pre 73.  Says they can't just sell me bracket, would have to buy new setup.  I have planned on going to poly bushings and MOOG joints with a adjustable upper control arm from magnum force.  Also Bilstein shocks with a 7/8 rear sway bar.  I would like for it to handle a little better but also would like that raked look.   This has been giving me fitts trying to figure out what to do.  Any advice is appreciated.

The answer is, "It depends."


If the new bar has the same amount of offset in the hex from end to end, it will set higher at a common adjuster setting.  In other words, if the adjuster  bolt is sticking out one inch on both sets of bars, then the car will set higher in the front with the new bars.

If the new bars don't have the same amount of "twist" end to end, then all bets are off as the adjustment will be different.

[Chryco Psycho]

generally the larger bars will slide right in & improving handing . The torsion bars are adjustable to allow for ride height , the clocking of the bar will allow for more or less adjustment height . I will be changing the bars & make the adjustment to get the ride height back

[brads70]

Brad, you could have bought an old Porsche for less if that is what you like! 

 No way It had to be a Mopar!    Any moron could just open his wallet and by a good handling car, now a Mopar... we are in a class all by ourselves! 

[Strawdawg]

I am too subtle with my humor as no one ever gets it here! 

I was inferring that if you wanted a tail wagger, you could have bought an old Porsche and had all the wagging you wanted for no more investment as they were oversteering fools once you hit the point of no return.

I agree with your Mopar sentiments otherwise. 

[brads70]

I am too subtle with my humor as no one ever gets it here! 

I was inferring that if you wanted a tail wagger, you could have bought an old Porsche and had all the wagging you wanted for no more investment as they were oversteering fools once you hit the point of no return.

I agree with your Mopar sentiments otherwise. 

Gotcha!  I never knew Porsche were like that, never have driven one. I prefere a little loose  over pushing in the corners.

[Kevin71]

Is there any way to know how much twist there is and which brands are different.  If I got a set of .96 mopar bars would they have identical twist.  But wouldn't the 1" or 1.03" be better than the .96.  And how would you clock the lower control arm when installing.  Would simply raise the lower control arm a little to clock it.  Can some one point me to some instructions on how this is done.   I spoke with Hotchkess today and they are saying with there upper control arms would drop it a little because it relocates the UCA down a little bit to correct geometry.  I guess I should have paid attention in Geometery class 35 years ago, maybe it would make a little more sense.  Anyway they say I need to use a shorter bilstein shock on the front as it will be lowered.  They didn't think the car would sit higher with beefier torision bars.  The clocking them makes sense to me. 

[Strawdawg]

mainly from looking at the pics, I think.

Bars under 1.0 have an offset from one end to the other

Some bars that are larger don't have an offset.

My PST 1.03" bars do not, but, the pics of the Hotchkis 1.03" appear to have one to me.

I have to screw the adjusters in quite a bit to get the ride height I want.  Trying to install them one "flat" installed was impossible with the ball joints connected....Just for the heck of it, I disconnected the upper and dropped the lower arm down so that I could get the bars in with that "one flat" difference.  Then got a couple of guys to stand on the front end so I could reconnected the upper joint...placed the fender lip close to a foot above the tire

Changing it back to the correct position gave me a floor to fender lip distance of about 24.25" which is what I wanted...but the adjuster was turned within a 1/2" of max.

On the other hand, with a stiff bar like the 1.03", a little movement of the adjuster moves the car quite a bit once there has been some preload applied.  I could get a lot more clearance with a little more adjustment.

[Kevin71]

The car is up on jack stands right now but if I remeber correctly it is at 25" floor to fender lip and the adjusters are adjusted in maybe a 1/2 inch to inch from no adjustment or just barely touching the adjuster.  But they are .92 bars and it bottoms out badley on the frame.  Having it sit at 24 1/4 would be nice if it didn't bottom out.  I will call hotckiss and ask about this.  I guess by disconnecting the upper control arm and pulling the lower one down to put the bar in is basicly clocking this thing.  Is that right.

[Strawdawg]

yep, it was a trial to settle an argument...does not work

[brads70]

  And how would you clock the lower control arm when installing.  Would simply raise the lower control arm a little to clock it.  Can some one point me to some instructions on how this is done.   I spoke with Hotchkess today and they are saying with there upper control arms would drop it a little because it relocates the UCA down a little bit to correct geometry.  I guess I should have paid attention in Geometery class 35 years ago, maybe it would make a little more sense.  Anyway they say I need to use a shorter bilstein shock on the front as it will be lowered.  They didn't think the car would sit higher with beefier torision bars.  The clocking them makes sense to me.

About what Hotchkis said...I'm just not seeing that? I don't care where you mount the upper control arm it won't change where the LCA sits? Only a dropped spindle would do that.
What bump stops do you have on the LCA's? You could get shorter ones or cut some off  to get more travel.
  I never had any trouble installing my torsion bars? Even with the stock set up, before my C-body set up?
My 1" torsion bars came from Just suspension if that's any help to you?

[Kevin71]

About Hotchkiss I had the same feeling I just couldn't see how there upper control arms are going to have any different impact than say a magnum force double adjustable and they are considerably less.  I have been trying to sort all this out before I order everything.  I have already bought so many different parts that I thouht would be what I wanted only to find out it won't work with some other modification thats already been done or something.  It can be a real waste of money sometimes but the forum has been a tremendous help.  I haven't drove the car in probably a month and I am really jonesing.  I guess I am a mopar junkie now beats crack by a long shot.  Maybe more expensive though.  I can't wait to I get this storker motor put in .  I am going to a 522 stroker and I want to get the front end redone and make sure I can stop it. 

[brads70]

About Hotchkiss I had the same feeling I just couldn't see how there upper control arms are going to have any different impact than say a magnum force double adjustable and they are considerably less.  I have been trying to sort all this out before I order everything.  I have already bought so many different parts that I thouht would be what I wanted only to find out it won't work with some other modification thats already been done or something.  It can be a real waste of money sometimes but the forum has been a tremendous help.  I haven't drove the car in probably a month and I am really jonesing.  I guess I am a mopar junkie now beats crack by a long shot.  Maybe more expensive though.  I can't wait to I get this storker motor put in .  I am going to a 522 stroker and I want to get the front end redone and make sure I can stop it.

Where the upper control arm is mounted WILL make a diference in handling but it won't change were the LCA's are positioned. I bought the Hotchkis upper arms because they looked like strong parts and wouldn't break, and for the adjustablility . The relocated mounts/antidive feature was a bonus?, just a sales pitch to me. Sounds good? Like how is anyone supposed to know the difference if there claims/theory is correct ?
In my opinion the #1 thing that effects handling in a Mopar is getting rid of bumpsteer, the rest is just "fluff"
Mopar's and handling are a sort of newer territory as 99% of Mopar owners are into drag racing not corners.
I think you can make a pretty good package with the magnum force uppers, just do your homework. Measure the bumpsteer and compensate the best you can ? 
Making power with a Mopar is the easy part!  Getting it to corner and stop well is the challenge in my opinion?