Ford 2003-2004 Mach 1 rims on E-body?

[go-fish]

Dodj, I see you're point.  I thought the same way before, just sort of imagining the spacer being part of the wheel, the distance from the mounting surface (the back of the spacer)  but (And I could be very wrong about this) the surface of the rim on the wheel with a 6" back space is where the verticle load force is and is pushed outward, acting like a lever arm and increasing the load on the hub area.

And the fact that you listened to Cooter, who has an obvious dislike for anything other than stock wheel and tire configuration.

[go-fish]

The money you save on the rims, you will have spent and much more when you realize too late that 17" tires wear out QUICK when driven hard.

Cooter, you are so ignorant and biased it's not even funny. You just talk out your azz all the time don't you. Do you even think what you are typing is even factual or do you just "feel" a certain and type whatever that is. In this instance you feel that Mopars should have around stock wheel diameters, 14-15".

Do you know anything about tires? Because if you did you would know what a UTGQ rating is and know that it's entirely possible to have a 17,18,19,20,22" tire that has a higher UTGQ rating than some 14 and 15" tires. In fact, I could look on a tire retailer website right now and I could find exact names and sizes, with corresponding ratings, to further expose you as the fraud you are.

That's right I said fraud. I say this because, if I remember correctly, you have stated that you are some kind of authority on Mopars and general automobilia.  Is this because you were alive when musclecars were new? Or do you work in the industry? Gearhead are you?
If you were any one of those you should know what the little markings on tires were. If you have ever even shopped for tires, any size, you should know what a UTGQ rating is. It's the basis of how long the tire is supposed to last. You know, 50,000 mi tires, 70,000 mi tires......

In the future if you could try not to steer people's automotive related buying decisions based on the fact that you "like" 15" tires that would help out more people than you know, just by keeping your mouth shut.

The UTQG rating is made up of three components:


 Treadwear

The treadwear grade is a comparative rating based on the wear rate of the tire when tested under controlled conditions on a specified government test track. A tire graded 200 would last twice as long on the government test course under specified test conditions as one graded 100. It is an oversimplification to assume treadwear grades will be proportional directly to your actual tire mileage. The relative performance of tires depends upon the actual conditions of their use and may vary due to driving habits, service practices, differences in road characteristics and climate.


 Traction

Traction grades, from highest to lowest, are AA, A, B and C. They represent the tire's ability to stop on wet pavement as measured under controlled conditions on specified government test surfaces of asphalt and concrete. The testing does not take into account cornering, hydroplaning or acceleration.


 Temperature

The temperature grades, from highest to lowest, are A, B and C. These represent the tire's resistance to the generation of heat.

UTQG Treadwear Grades are based on actual road use in which the test tire is run in a vehicle convoy along with standardized Course Monitoring Tires. The vehicle repeatedly runs a prescribed 400-mile test loop in West Texas for a total of 7,200 miles. The vehicle can have its alignment set, air pressure checked and tires rotated every 800 miles. The test tire's and the Monitoring Tire's wear are measured during and at the conclusion of the test. The tire manufacturers then assign a Treadwear Grade based on the observed wear rates. The Course Monitoring Tire is assigned a grade and the test tire receives a grade indicating its relative treadwear. A grade of 100 would indicate that the tire tread would last as long as the test tire, 200 would indicate the tread would last twice as long, 300 would indicate three times as long, etc.

[Super Blue 72]

Ok, old thread resurrected. 

Cruised craigslist and found a decent set for $200 with tires last week.  A little oxidation on two of them around the pony emblem but ok for now.  Tires are worn but they hold air which is what I needed as the car isn't on the road yet.  Just want to make them fit for now.  Thought they were a decent deal so I snagged them as Mach 1 rims with no tires can sell for up to $400.  Plus they aren't as easy to find as other rims like the Bullitt rims so I figured I should grab them as they look like modern Magnum 500s to some degree.

Will have to figure out the spacers/hub deal. 

Took a quick measurement and the back space if measured from the mounting surface to the top of the rear lip of the rim is 6 inches which may require me to get 1.5" spacers.

When I get a chance  I'll mock it up by keeping the suspension at the proper height with the jack under the control arm/rear axle and see if 1" or 1.5" will be needed for spacers.

We'll see.... 

[Padawan]

When I get a chance  I'll mock it up by keeping the suspension at the proper height with the jack under the control arm/rear axle and see if 1" or 1.5" will be needed for spacers.

We'll see.... 

 

[Super Blue 72]

Hi Padawan!  How have you been?  I was thinking of you the other day.  Been out in the Challenger lately?

Will post pics but my computer crashed so I don't want to put any pics on my wife's computer.

[dodj]

Took a quick measurement and the back space if measured from the mounting surface to the top of the rear lip of the rim is 6 inches which may require me to get 1.5" spacers.

How wide is the rim? I'm using a 9" rim with 6" backspace with a 1" spacer. (in the front)

[Super Blue 72]

Hi dodj, how you been?

From what I have seen these rims like the Bullitt style rims are 17x8.  I took a quick measurement of the backspace and it looked like 6" coming out to the edge of the lip on the inside of the rim.

According to a Ford forum: "The 17x8 Bullitt wheels have the EXACT same dimension as your Mach 1 wheels. They are both 17x8 with a 5 3/4" BS with a 30mm offset."

So, in theory, if I use a 1" or 1 1/4" spacer I should be ok if I want 4.5" back space front and rear.  I don't think they make 1 1/4" spacers.  They might.  Mostly have seen 1" or 1.5" spacers. 

I thought with a 6" back psace I might go with a 1.5" spacer but I was a little worried about rubbing the fender lip.  That's why I need to find some time to position the tires and see what works best.  Just have to find time, pretty busy here.  I f I go with the 1.5" spacer then that's a little less I have to worry about grinding off the hub or the center hub register on the rim.  We will see....

[dodj]

I'm good Super Blue! Heading to Vegas for a few days. Haven't been since '87. I hear it has changed a bit.   

Ya, with a 8" rim I think 4.5" back space is what you would shoot for to centre the wheel. I went for a 5" bs cuz I have the 9" rim & 255 rubber, and 72blu'n'blu said the 275 front tires he crammed in there worked with 5" bs.
Is the hub bore at least 72.6mm?

[Super Blue 72]

I'm good Super Blue! Heading to Vegas for a few days. Haven't been since '87. I hear it has changed a bit.   

Ya, with a 8" rim I think 4.5" back space is what you would shoot for to centre the wheel. I went for a 5" bs cuz I have the 9" rim & 255 rubber, and 72blu'n'blu said the 275 front tires he crammed in there worked with 5" bs.
Is the hub bore at least 72.6mm?

72.6mm?  Is that how wide the stock hub is?  That's like 2.85".  I thought it was like 2.78"?    I thought I took some measurements a while ago and 2.78" rings a bell.  I can't verify those numbers as my measurements were on my laptop that crashed.    When I can I'll measure the hub hole and the rotor hub.

[Super Blue 72]

Ok, dodj, I think you are correct.  I used a non digital micrometer and measured and it's like 2.8".  Your number of 72.6 or roughly 7.3mm is the only measurement I have seen looking around.  73mm=2.87 inches which is close to what our hubs are so I'm hoping only a little "coersion" of the rim is needed. 

So I tried to mount the rim and of course as expected it didn't fit over the hub.  But what I did notice on the Mach 1 rim is a thin ridge of wheel material that is at the lip of the center hole of the rim that looks fairly easy to ground down.    Might go that route instead of tampering with the rotor hub especially as that is harder metal to deal with. 

I'm going to document my measurements here in case my computer crashes again! 


So as far as approximate primitive measurements go:

Challenger:
Hub width:    ~2.8"
Hub height with grease cap:  ~2.5"
Hub height alone:    ~ 1 5/8"
Stud height:   1"


Mach 1 rim:

Center hole width:   ~2.75?
Center hole depth to center cap:       ~2 5/8"

From a Mustang site: "The 17x8 Bullitt wheels have the EXACT same dimension as your Mach 1 wheels. They are both 17x8 with a 5 3/4" BS with a 30mm offset."

Wheels 17 x 8-inch Magnum 500-style "Heritage Style" (5 spoke)
Tires Goodyear 245/45ZR17 Eagle ZR45


If those numbers from the Mustang site are right, I would need a 1.25" spacer to get the backspace to 4.5.  I'll play with the center hole then measure the backspace need.


Time to get the file and grinder out! 

[Super Blue 72]

Ok, got some pics and might make it to Home Depot to get a grinding stone or something.  I'll see what they have.

Pardon the ill matched paint.  Super Blue (TB3) is not the same as Corporate blue/engine paint blue as you can see!

[Super Blue 72]

A couple more...

[Super Blue 72]

Weird, in the past pic is that a paint daub?  Are these factory rotors?  I have a 106k miles so I doubt it... 

[Super Blue 72]

This is a old store sunglass display I snagged for free.  I used it when I refinished my Magnum 500s. 

It's so much easier to put a wheel on top and rotate it without having to move the wheel itself. 

Plus when using the grinder I'll hopefully get a more fluid motion to the grinder instead of having to stop and rotate the tire.

[Super Blue 72]

Used a Dremel tool, course file and then a grinding stone to smooth it out.  Hope it works!    I'll see when I get a chance to test fit the rim.