727 to A518 swap – a novice guide

Author Topic: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide  (Read 282366 times)

Offline PlumCrazyChris

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #180 on: December 02, 2016 - 10:45:58 AM »
With your 3.54 gears and in .69 overdrive from the 518, you'll have a 2.44 final drive ratio.  There are a lot of speed vs rpm calculators out there, just Google them, plug in your tire size and find out what your rpm will be at what speed your interested in.

I have a bolt up (no welding) trans cross member kit for this swap, if anyone is interested.
PlumCrazyChris
Mopar Muscle Cars of Austin
Round Rock Tx
70 Challenger 5.7, A518, A/C
70 Challenger 340 convertible (Gone to Sweden)
68 Barracuda (sold it too)
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Offline PlumCrazyChris

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #181 on: January 22, 2017 - 09:55:18 PM »
Several folks have asked about the cross member I made for my 518 swap.  The only option was do it myself or pay an outrageous amount to have one made and hope it worked out.  My issue was I didn't weld, so I had to come up with one that didn't require it.  I made a template that folded out flat, and laid it out on some flat steel I had and then had it cut out.  Then I used a torch from home depot, put in my vice and heated it up and bent it up with my hammer.  Its held together with bolts and doesn't require welding, although welding it would certainly make it stiffer. 

I've requested some quotes from local metal suppliers to see what they will charge to cut it out for me.  When I hear back from them, I'll post the costs if any of you would like to get one for your tranny swap.  The swap is fantastic I must say.  I wish I'd have known about it many years ago. 

FYI 93-95 conversion vans are great sources for these transmissions at junkyards. 

Chris
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« Last Edit: January 22, 2017 - 09:58:36 PM by PlumCrazyChris »
PlumCrazyChris
Mopar Muscle Cars of Austin
Round Rock Tx
70 Challenger 5.7, A518, A/C
70 Challenger 340 convertible (Gone to Sweden)
68 Barracuda (sold it too)
www.mopar.org

Offline roadrunninMark

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #182 on: January 22, 2017 - 10:18:04 PM »
Looks great Chris!   :clapping:

Offline wantone

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Re: 727 to A518 swap � a novice guide
« Reply #183 on: January 22, 2017 - 10:58:06 PM »
Dayum... too bad you don't do this for cash.
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Offline PlumCrazyChris

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Re: 727 to A518 swap � a novice guide
« Reply #184 on: January 22, 2017 - 11:31:13 PM »
Dayum... too bad you don't do this for cash.

Oh I'll do it for cash.  I just need to figure out how much its going to cost to get them punched out.  Then I'll be happy to sell them.  This is a great swap, and is really pretty straight forward.  Its much cheaper than any aftermarket option.   I figure I have about $600-700 in my trans swap, tranny included.  I hope everyone with an E or B body does it.  It will sure make driving these old cars better and easier to do more often.
PlumCrazyChris
Mopar Muscle Cars of Austin
Round Rock Tx
70 Challenger 5.7, A518, A/C
70 Challenger 340 convertible (Gone to Sweden)
68 Barracuda (sold it too)
www.mopar.org

Offline Cudakiller70

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #185 on: January 23, 2017 - 12:42:37 AM »
Well done man! I have experience with metal fab and you did that very well!
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Offline ShelbyDogg

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #186 on: January 23, 2017 - 12:50:56 AM »
 Chris that is a good solution to hold up the trans, but remember the original one also  tied both sides of the torsion bar crossmember together to strengthen it because the front suspension is causing that crossmember to try and twist. As the car bounces up and down. Since you have it bent to fit, take it to a friend to weld and add plates between the bolt holes. What would that cost? Probably free or $20 depending on your friend.
Rob

3 E-bodies, Megasquirt-1v3.0, Edelbrock Pro-Flo-1, Holley C950, FAST EZ-EFI; say no to carbs...yes to throttle bodies

My Pace Car restoration thread:
http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=44869.0


Offline Cudakiller70

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #187 on: January 23, 2017 - 12:58:16 AM »
**Bringing this back from the dead............

 Its a pro touring with 18's front 19's rear ...
Very nice car! Very sharp! Like how you did the top dark. I'm thinking of doing an AAR type look and wanted a black top and hood without the vinyl top. Thanks
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Offline roadrunninMark

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #188 on: January 23, 2017 - 09:17:50 PM »
Shelbydog, do you mean add brackets like this (red colors)?


Offline ShelbyDogg

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #189 on: January 24, 2017 - 12:15:39 AM »
That and also where your hand is but on both sides.
That thing has to be strong to solidly tie both sides into one solid member. Compare yours to an original one then add metal till it looks similar in strength.

I remember reading someplace along time ago, that you should loosen the control arm torsion bar adjusters whenever you take off the transmission mount.  I never did it but all of my suspension weight is off of the bars when I jack up the car,  and the tires are hanging.
Rob

3 E-bodies, Megasquirt-1v3.0, Edelbrock Pro-Flo-1, Holley C950, FAST EZ-EFI; say no to carbs...yes to throttle bodies

My Pace Car restoration thread:
http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=44869.0


Offline roadrunninMark

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #190 on: January 24, 2017 - 10:13:17 AM »
Chris, check out USCartool's bracket.  They use 3/16" steel.  That thick and you won't be able to bend it though.  I agree with Shelbydog's opinion that it does more then hold the trans in.  Will definitely need to weld it then.

http://store.uscartool.com/67-75-A-Body-518-Crossmember-Kit_p_141.html

Offline PlumCrazyChris

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #191 on: January 24, 2017 - 12:36:39 PM »
Posted by: ShelbyDogg
« on: January 23, 2017 - 12:50:56 AM » Insert Quote
 Chris that is a good solution to hold up the trans, but remember the original one also  tied both sides of the torsion bar crossmember together to strengthen it because the front suspension is causing that crossmember to try and twist. As the car bounces up and down. Since you have it bent to fit, take it to a friend to weld and add plates between the bolt holes. What would that cost? Probably free or $20 depending on your friend.



I've thought of that and agree, that if I am going to remake these I'd use thicker metal than I used, but not much thicker.  I used 1/8" plate that I had hanging around for years.  That photo does make it look thinner. 

I requested quotes for 3/16" mild steel.   With the dashed bending cuts I designed into it, I don't think anyone would have any trouble bending a 3/16" thick one into shape.  I used a Map gas torch from home depot that worked great, but I probably didn't need the torch. 

It would likely be stiffer if it was welded, but even without welding your certainly not going to bend this once assembled with your bare hands, its quite strong and would be even stronger with thicker steel.  You could certainly include a boxed bracket, like you show with the red shading and as UStool did it, but then you'd have to weld it, which defeats the do-it-yourself purpose.  In many safety applications welding isn't allowed and only bolts are acceptable, since welds can be questionable and subject to failure. 

I disagree that this bracket has to withstand torsional deflection or needs to reinforce the torsion bar frame for any type of "twisting" load.  I think the torsion bar frame rail stands alone and does not need to be reinforced, but in the case of a Dukes type landing the torsional load from the T-bars would tend to "Spread" the T-bar frame rail and then the frame material itself (which is thinner then the trans cross member) would be the suspect material to fail at the welded in sockets. 

I think the cross member does add rigidity to the frame rail, because it triangulates the engine mounting points to the T-bar frame rail, and could help prevent any potential vertical spreading of the frame, but that is only in the most extreme instances of momentary impact to the front suspension.   If your going to do Dukes of Hazard jumps, then the trans cross member is the least of your issues.  :) 

I used the chevy one bolt mounting bushing (from a Camaro I think, its probably discussed somewhere in this thread), and made a 1"spacer to raise the trans until it touched the tunnel.  For some reason, these new Hemis seem to tilt backward a couple degrees which looks kinda weird in the engine bay, but also lowers the rear of the transmission.  So I went through several iterations of marking where the trans touched the tunnel, then lowered it, then pounded the tunnel up with a maul to gain some more clearance.  That's one thing I learned with this rebuild is that any custom application is going to require some massaging. 

I think one of the trickiest issues with this swap is how to get the speedometer cable through the cross member to the transmission.  The location where the cable screws into the trans is different, relative to the cross member, depending on what trans you use.  At first I used a built A-500, but thought I was having trouble with it when I couldn't get my engine to run right while it was missing a push rod.  So I put a A518 in it, I had more clearance with the 518, I was actually able to thread the cable through the cross member instead of behind it for much less cable binding than with the A-500.   Something to think about...
PlumCrazyChris
Mopar Muscle Cars of Austin
Round Rock Tx
70 Challenger 5.7, A518, A/C
70 Challenger 340 convertible (Gone to Sweden)
68 Barracuda (sold it too)
www.mopar.org

Offline Cudakiller70

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #192 on: January 24, 2017 - 01:11:46 PM »
What is the thickness of the factory crossmember?

« Last Edit: January 24, 2017 - 01:13:58 PM by Cudakiller70 »
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Offline PlumCrazyChris

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #193 on: January 24, 2017 - 07:59:21 PM »
What is the thickness of the factory crossmember?

Not sure, mine will be 3/16".
PlumCrazyChris
Mopar Muscle Cars of Austin
Round Rock Tx
70 Challenger 5.7, A518, A/C
70 Challenger 340 convertible (Gone to Sweden)
68 Barracuda (sold it too)
www.mopar.org

Offline duodec

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Re: 727 to A518 swap – a novice guide
« Reply #194 on: January 24, 2017 - 11:28:57 PM »
Got an NOS 3583188 waiting for my car since previous owner did some bad welding on the factory unit.

The wings that bolt to the torsion bar mount members are 0.15" - 0.16"at the edges.  The two pieces that come back to hold the trans mount are 0.18" - 0.19" thick.  However all I have are calipers, not a micrometer, and the stamping likely distorted the edges enough to not get a truly accurate reading.  Of course no idea what grade of steel its made from either.

Hope that helps.