440 solid roller cam selection

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    Author Topic: 440 solid roller cam selection  (Read 11119 times)

    Offline high perf mopar

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    440 solid roller cam selection
    « on: July 04, 2012 - 08:29:42 PM »
    hey guys what do u think about these cams.im not racing the car just want "somewhat" decent idle charicteristics without having to idle it at 1400 like im doing now..and most important,,sound bad a$$ when i pull into the car shows..nothing beats the sound of a solid roller!i want the most duration at 50 that i can run without giving up too much low rpm driveability,,happy medium trade off..dont want the car to die when clicking it into gear..+some vacuum,,unlike the 4.75 inches i have now in gear at 1400 rpm.drops to 900 in drive.
    motor
    440 with 10.2 c/r with rpm heads
    3500 stall hughes converter,,tight,probably only equals 2800-3000.
    3.55 gears
    tti headers

    lunati
    •Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 273/279
    •Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 243/249
    •Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .578/.585
    •LSA/ICL: 110/106
    •Valve Lash (Int/Exh): 016/016
    •RPM Range: 2800-6800
    •Includes: Cam Only
    needs 10.1 c/r and 3.90 gears
    #60332

    comp cams
    280/286 total duration
    242/248@ 50
    570/576 lift
    110 lsa
    106 c/l
    2500-6200 range
    9 .5 to 1,,3000 stall converter
    xr280r

    iv'e been told that the duration at 50 is the number that will make or break the combination..

    lifters r another subject,,will be pulling the motor out at the end of the car show season..
    currently running 906 heads,,9.5 c/r
    comp cams solid lifter
    555 lift
    306/306
    262@50 both
    110/106
    boy did i pick the wrong cam!!LOL..

    any thoughts..

     
    « Last Edit: July 04, 2012 - 08:34:29 PM by high perf mopar »
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds


    Offline Chryco Psycho

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #1 on: July 04, 2012 - 11:52:42 PM »
    getting under 250 @ .050 will definatly help you , you can get virtualy the same grind in a solid flat tappet from Lunati as well . I use them all the time
     I would go with the Lunati over the Comp grind as the designer is a hardcore Mopar guy . I would talk to Lunati tech , I use the TF 57/TF60 or the TF 60 / TF60 a lot they will get you about .570 lift with 1.5 rockers at 250 * duration @ .050
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    Offline high perf mopar

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #2 on: July 05, 2012 - 06:55:49 PM »
    interesting ideas,,after reading up on solid roller lifters concerning the need for pressured oil rollers to live on the street they make those solids look pretty good chryco was talking about..995.00 a set :22yikes:  better start picking up pennys from the parking lots now!240/250@50ish and i think i will be right where i need to be,,

    u know,i've always wondered about this converter..i thought for a 3500 stall it would be alot looser than this,,on some other forums people r saying that the hughes r tighter and not any where near the advertized stall speeds due to them not wanting to have to deal with burnt trans/converters from end users..i would be surprised if its even 2500..

    maybe i should have gone with tci...some one back in the past mentioned that they had one from tci/3000 stall and when dropping it into gear the motor barely changed pitch???motors coming out in october so theres time to figure all this out..next time on the road will do the flash test on this converter.. i might have to change it also when the motors out.
    « Last Edit: July 05, 2012 - 06:59:03 PM by high perf mopar »
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds

    Offline PlumCraZRT

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #3 on: July 05, 2012 - 08:30:39 PM »
    Quote from: high perf mopar on July 05, 2012 - 06:55:49 PM
    interesting ideas,,after reading up on solid roller lifters concerning the need for pressured oil rollers to live on the street they make those solids look pretty good chryco was talking about..995.00 a set :22yikes:  better start picking up pennys from the parking lots now!240/250@50ish and i think i will be right where i need to be,,

    u know,i've always wondered about this converter..i thought for a 3500 stall it would be alot looser than this,,on some other forums people r saying that the hughes r tighter and not any where near the advertized stall speeds due to them not wanting to have to deal with burnt trans/converters from end users..i would be surprised if its even 2500..

    maybe i should have gone with tci...some one back in the past mentioned that they had one from tci/3000 stall and when dropping it into gear the motor barely changed pitch???motors coming out in october so theres time to figure all this out..next time on the road will do the flash test on this converter.. i might have to change it also when the motors out.

    After speaking with several different converter companies (maybe 8 in total), I've come to learn that you can expect very little to be the same between two companies.  I was speaking with an engineer at one company who told me some places advertise brake stall and others flash stall.  On top of that, the engine's torque curve can alter the stall speed(s) dramatically, so the engine setup is an important variable.  Basically an advertised stall speed means very little.

    I got all sorts recommendations from $300 street converters to $1200 race converters (even within the same company).  I really don't know what to believe now.
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    mmmmm.... Mopar.... *drool*

    Offline high perf mopar

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #4 on: July 06, 2012 - 08:48:40 PM »
    Quote from: PlumCraZRT on July 05, 2012 - 08:30:39 PM
    After speaking with several different converter companies (maybe 8 in total), I've come to learn that you can expect very little to be the same between two companies.  I was speaking with an engineer at one company who told me some places advertise brake stall and others flash stall.  On top of that, the engine's torque curve can alter the stall speed(s) dramatically, so the engine setup is an important variable.  Basically an advertised stall speed means very little.

    I got all sorts recommendations from $300 street converters to $1200 race converters (even within the same company).  I really don't know what to believe now.


    yeah,i believe that,,it sounds like a crap shoot with them..like a box of candy,,wtf am i going to get..
    i do like this article from mopar muscle on 1 of the cams im looking at..comp cams xr280-r solid roller..that engine is identical to mine except for the six pack intake/carbs..that i will be putting together,,bottom end is already in the car,,heads r on the bench..1200.00 craigslist's for the heads new in the boxes,,60929's.

    http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/engine/mopp_0110_edelbrock_aluminum_big_block_mopar_heads/viewall.html
    « Last Edit: July 06, 2012 - 08:54:30 PM by high perf mopar »
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds

    Offline high perf mopar

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #5 on: July 07, 2012 - 12:55:33 AM »
    Quote from: -Sledgehammer- on July 07, 2012 - 12:25:08 AM
    nice read... I had the TM7 on a set of 906's and eddy rpms with a dominator and the XR286R on a stroker :working:

    xr286r,,248/254@50,,,how was the idle//vacuum,,streetable..or 1500 rpm idle dies in gear at 800 rpm??

    i know u said in another post that the idle char of rollers is diff than flat tappets,more forgiving??,looking for input to pull the trigger on the cam..
    « Last Edit: July 07, 2012 - 01:04:09 AM by high perf mopar »
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds

    Offline high perf mopar

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #6 on: July 07, 2012 - 12:41:30 PM »
    Quote from: -Sledgehammer- on July 07, 2012 - 05:36:50 AM
    the XR286R has and intake valve closing ABDC of 69 which is great for a pump gas engine and going to eddys will raise your compression some alone with the 84cc combustion chamber (the 906 is actually a good bit higher than that maybe neil has specs but im thinking realistically 94cc maybe)! I can't remember the exact vacuum reading in gear etc... the car is in France right now with the new owner.

    just listen for yourself how the xr286R sounds! although my dart sounds great... it to me, just doesn't have the sound the chally did! (same exhaust and everything)  :2cents: I originally had a coan 11" that I believe stalled at 3000ish (sold it to a member on here) and although may not be optimal for track ET worked very well on the street with the cam...

    (Ignore the little kid in the video he is local kid that loves to help on my cars and gave him his first ride  :lol2: )

    Dodge Challenger 500" N/A Pump Gas


    that sounds great,thanks for sharing,sounded like the kid had a white knuckle grip holding on!!
    and most important for me your engine idled down and did not die when u dropped it into gear..thats what i need for my use,,and sounded really good..my current cam sounds that way,,,,,,,,,,,,but idleing at 1400+ u cant tell..
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds

    Offline 73EStroker

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #7 on: July 07, 2012 - 02:34:20 PM »
    I am going to change out my Lunati solid flat tappet to a Lunati solid roller for my 451 to bring the power band down to a more cop friendly level. Granted, I watch the wifes head just about go through the headrest on a shift from 3-4 at around 100mph but that is where this thing wants to run at present. Going down from 586 lift and 255@050 to same lift and about 240@050. Stayiing with Lunati. Also I cannot access my work email but a fellow in the US makes solid roller lifters for Mopar and they run 9000RPM on circle track racers continuous. He said they have not had a failure. $400 for the set. He will sell cam and lifter package for $700. That is the guy I am using. Going down to Panama manana, for a week, to visit CP and his wife. Will post that lifter guys info when I return on 15th July.
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    Offline high perf mopar

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #8 on: July 07, 2012 - 08:45:42 PM »
    Quote from: 73EStroker on July 07, 2012 - 02:34:20 PM
    I am going to change out my Lunati solid flat tappet to a Lunati solid roller for my 451 to bring the power band down to a more cop friendly level. Granted, I watch the wifes head just about go through the headrest on a shift from 3-4 at around 100mph but that is where this thing wants to run at present. Going down from 586 lift and 255@050 to same lift and about 240@050. Stayiing with Lunati. Also I cannot access my work email but a fellow in the US makes solid roller lifters for Mopar and they run 9000RPM on circle track racers continuous. He said they have not had a failure. $400 for the set. He will sell cam and lifter package for $700. That is the guy I am using. Going down to Panama manana, for a week, to visit CP and his wife. Will post that lifter guys info when I return on 15th July.
    thanks for the info..have fun on that vacation,,i think i need one too..lol.those prices r pretty much std appx for cam lifters only,non pressureized oiled lifters..

    from what i understand its not the higher rpm's that when using solid rollers we have to be aware of it's the lower rpm's street cruising/idleing where the non pressureized oiled roller's could/would have a potenial longevity problem..without pressureized oil going to the rollers they rely on splash oil.at lower rpm's theres not alot app...comp advertises edm p.o.lifters but when u start reading the details they start to say but if its this or that it doesn't apply..devils in the details..looks to me like they r reffering to me:(

    and when u do find them,,crower/isky/crane/etc,,they want twice as much for mopar as chevy..B.S.looking forward to here what your source has to say,,thanks.
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds

    Offline Chryco Psycho

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #9 on: July 07, 2012 - 09:52:59 PM »
    http://www.forebodiesonly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5253
     MLS is the Lifter supplier . , I was telling 73E stroker he should just use a different gear ratio to bring the rpm up at the same speeds , easier than a cam swap , but yes his combo does work well !! not that I got to ride in it , everytime I was there it was snowing !! :smilielol:
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    Offline high perf mopar

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #10 on: July 14, 2012 - 10:20:08 PM »
    Quote from: Chryco Psycho on July 04, 2012 - 11:52:42 PM
    getting under 250 @ .050 will definatly help you , you can get virtualy the same grind in a solid flat tappet from Lunati as well . I use them all the time
     I would go with the Lunati over the Comp grind as the designer is a hardcore Mopar guy . I would talk to Lunati tech , I use the TF 57/TF60 or the TF 60 / TF60 a lot they will get you about .570 lift with 1.5 rockers at 250 * duration @ .050
    hey chryco,,u know after running my dyno-sim app,using the lunati solid flat tappet #60341,the thing made 596 hp and 571 ft lbs torque ..at 1500 rpm's its at 464 :22yikes:!!way up from my appx 249!!with the current set up..and a hell of alot less expensive..does this sound right?am i looking in the wrong direction here..the bennys to to the roller r ob but with zddp in the oil,,,did i just save 1000.00??
     
     
    « Last Edit: July 14, 2012 - 10:49:13 PM by high perf mopar »
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    1971 barracuda
    440-6 shaker
    chrysler 3x2 competiton carbs mech,what chrysler should have done.
    b-5 blue
    "you got yourself some motor there boy!" 1973,,white lightning.MGM studios burt reynolds

    Offline Chryco Psycho

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #11 on: July 15, 2012 - 07:20:01 AM »
    sounds right , we made over 400 ft lbs torque at the tires from 1800 -5200 rpm measured on a dyno using a custom flat tappet grind I had designed
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    Offline TernerPt

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    Re: 440 solid roller cam selection
    « Reply #12 on: January 16, 2017 - 07:40:51 AM »
    if you are unsure in your knowledge about past tenses, http://edit-it.org/blog/what-everyone-should-know-about-past-continuous has important facts about past continuous!
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