Major decision time.

[torqueaddict]

Heres the deal, I ordered my stroker kit from hughes engines. Everything was ok until I got information from Neil and the people building my engine. Kevin from hughes told me I could run 11:1 compression on pumped gas. I was CLEAR as crystal about this needing to be streetable and  use 91 but he didnt listen. After talking to Neal I realized i had two choices, send back the pistons and exchange them for the correct piston needed for the right combo or try to do something to lower my compression.  Neil advised me not to do business with them from the start but I didnt listen. I should have known something was wrong when I told him I wanted the 512 kit and he told me they were no good and they didnt sell alot of them so the crank was not in stock. I thought maybe we just had a misunderstanding and that I could still do business with them and I decided to send the pistons back and get the correct pistons. They had to order them and it took them over a week to get them. originally I was told there would be no extra charge for the correct piston. When they got them in stock they called and said i had to pay extra for the correct piston and shipping. Its bad enough they tried to charge me for rebalancing when they made the mistake but now this. I was upset, so I just asked about a complete refund.They told me I can get a refund but I have to pay the $400 restocking fee. So can either pay the restocking fee or pay for the pistons an extra 200 plus another 250 for balancing, or get my money back minus the restocking fee. I am in the mind of just getting my money back and going 440source even if it cost me more. I did not get my kit from 440 source to avoid paying the tax on it and now I think its gonna cost me even more than if I had went to 440 source in the first place. Not to mention how much aggravation and stress this has caused me. I tried call hughes back and negotiate the restocking fee but he insisted that he was right and EVERYONE ELSE was wrong. That really pissed me off.  So to add to that today I came into a 400 block. I am kinda want to play with that but I need to resolve this 440 issue first. I really dont know what to do. One thing is clear tho, I will never give hughes a red centilla of my money again in life. Any and all advise is appreciated guys.

[brads70]

What heads are you planning on using?
To lower the compression on what you have now, can you mill the pistons down, are the domed? , open up the combustion chambers on the heads?,  Upgrade to aluminum heads with bigger cc's in the combustion chamber?, bigger head gaskets in bore size and thickness? Cometic makes some bigger gaskets?  Keep the piston down the hole as much as possible?
 

[torqueaddict]

What heads are you planning on using?
To lower the compression on what you have now, can you mill the pistons down, are the domed? , open up the combustion chambers on the heads?,  Upgrade to aluminum heads with bigger cc's in the combustion chamber?, bigger head gaskets in bore size and thickness? Cometic makes some bigger gaskets?  Keep the piston down the hole as much as possible?
 

I have the 440source stealth heads. I could do that  I'm just really upset over the process. I think I would rather take the loss and go with a company that will take care of me. Neil and I went over many of the possible options it just seems like I'm not gonna get what I want no matter what. Anyway you look at it I'm spending more than I originally planned.

[72cudamaan]

I for one have had great luck with Hughes. Unfortunately, you are still in the learning process and cannot
speak "engine" fluently, which can create problems. 11:1 on 93 octane is borderline possible. With aluminum heads
and the right cam choice it would be close. You need to bleed cylinder pressure to get away with it. What pistons do you have? and has the block
been decked"milled"? Sounds to me like you jumped the gun and had Hughes order new parts when you didn't even
have a new game plan really set in place. And I'm sorry but buying from a company only to save on sales tax
with no factoring in of quality is a poor way to design an engine. Why didn't you look into reducing compression instead? Seems
like that might have been the better way to go. ie no extra cost for parts.

[torqueaddict]

I for one have had great luck with Hughes. Unfortunately, you are still in the learning process and cannot
speak "engine" fluently, which can create problems. 11:1 on 93 octane is borderline possible. With aluminum heads
and the right cam choice it would be close. You need to bleed cylinder pressure to get away with it. What pistons do you have? and has the block
been decked"milled"? Sounds to me like you jumped the gun and had Hughes order new parts when you didn't even
have a new game plan really set in place. And I'm sorry but buying from a company only to save on sales tax
with no factoring in of quality is a poor way to design an engine. Why didn't you look into reducing compression instead? Seems
like that might have been the better way to go. ie no extra cost for parts.



Your correct I don't know alot about this but I told him what I wanted and he didn't listen. What I am asking for has not changed.  Before they shipped the kit and after I talked to Neil. Even know he's saying that chrycho and most of the members on here don't know why they are talking about when they say you don't need that much compression. I think I may just bite the bullet and never do business with them again. The reason he told me to get those parts that don't work that well was because they didn't have a good selection of pistons and or parts. When I called I said I wanted a 512 kit with 10.5 compression. He tells me I need this other crap and that put me in this issue im in now. That's the truth. If he had given me what I asked for I would have been fin instead of tryin to just sell me what he had on the shelf. If he didn't have what I was askin for he could have just told me and I would have taken my business elsewhere.  I may not know cars but I am a salesman. Part of giving good service is listening to what the customer wants and give them what they ask for. If you can't do that you let them know. That part of qualifying the customer. Sales 101. Selling someone something they don't want and can't use hurts you as a company in the end and pisses off the customer.

[72cudamaan]

Without this thread becoming a peeing match, can we fix this?. You haven't answered any of my questions yet. It
seems that you're only 1/2 point from your desired compression. Depending on what type of pistons you have, what the deck height is,
and possibly using different head gaskets, it is very possible that you can easily lower the comp. ratio without
changing the pistons or having the rotating assy rebalanced. If you couldn't answer their questions about chamber size, deck height,
or even what cam profile you were going to use, they may have sent you what you needed. You stated in a quote " most
of the members on here don't know why they are talking about when they say you don't need that much compression." Is this an
accurate quote? Or can you clarify the statement please? I'm sure everyone on here wants to help but you got to quit jumping
the gun before you have all of the information you need to make a correct decision on what is needed. Good Luck.

[PlumCraZRT]

Without this thread becoming a peeing match, can we fix this?. You haven't answered any of my questions yet. It
seems that you're only 1/2 point from your desired compression. Depending on what type of pistons you have, what the deck height is,
and possibly using different head gaskets, it is very possible that you can easily lower the comp. ratio without
changing the pistons or having the rotating assy rebalanced. If you couldn't answer their questions about chamber size, deck height,
or even what cam profile you were going to use, they may have sent you what you needed. You stated in a quote " most
of the members on here don't know why they are talking about when they say you don't need that much compression." Is this an
accurate quote? Or can you clarify the statement please? I'm sure everyone on here wants to help but you got to quit jumping
the gun before you have all of the information you need to make a correct decision on what is needed. Good Luck.

He's got a good point.  Give us some dimensions and we can help you out.

Crank throw, bore diameter, rod length, piston compression height, deck height, cylinder head cc, piston dish cc?  (I'm probably missing one or two... I figure we can play with gasket thickness and deck height a little to change compression)

[Chryco Psycho]

the only way to get it Down to 11:1 is to either use a thick head gasket or not deck the block either way quench is lost . or dish the piston , or start porting the chamber to open it up approx 4 cc 

[torqueaddict]

Without this thread becoming a peeing match, can we fix this?. You haven't answered any of my questions yet. It
seems that you're only 1/2 point from your desired compression. Depending on what type of pistons you have, what the deck height is,
and possibly using different head gaskets, it is very possible that you can easily lower the comp. ratio without
changing the pistons or having the rotating assy rebalanced. If you couldn't answer their questions about chamber size, deck height,
or even what cam profile you were going to use, they may have sent you what you needed. You stated in a quote " most
of the members on here don't know why they are talking about when they say you don't need that much compression." Is this an
accurate quote? Or can you clarify the statement please? I'm sure everyone on here wants to help but you got to quit jumping
the gun before you have all of the information you need to make a correct decision on what is needed. Good Luck.

I think the deck height is standard, it hasnt been changed. The piston is a flat top icon piston with 4 cc. we dont know where the piston sits in the hole but the block has not been decked to my knowledge. Sorry about the bad quote I was using my cell phone to respond, Kevin from Hughes said that the people advising me like Neil didnt know what they were talking about. The people on here have been very knowlegdable and have always given me really good sound advise.

[torqueaddict]

the only way to get it Down to 11:1 is to either use a thick head gasket or not deck the block either way quench is lost . or dish the piston , or start porting the chamber to open it up approx 4 cc 

Neil I know thats why I had chosen to go with simply exchanging the piston. This is really frustrating  I just want this issue to go away. I really think I should just get my money back and go to 440source.

[PlumCraZRT]

I threw together a spread sheet to help you calculate compression ratio based on the measurements of various components.  You might want to take a look at this.

Obrviously you want to get your compression down a bit, but don't lose sight of "Quench Dist" (should be .040-.060").

"Deck Milled" and "Bored Out" should be positive values reflecting material removed (negative values would reflect material being added).  "Piston Dish" is the volume of a dish (a negative value would indicate a domed piston).  Where applicable, change the "cc" values and the "ci" values will update.

I took my best guess as to what your setup is... generally speaking, the 'yellow' dimensions are what we can easily change for the build.  Green boxes are calculation results.

Good luck,
Evan

[torqueaddict]

I threw together a spread sheet to help you calculate compression ratio based on the measurements of various components.  You might want to take a look at this.

Obrviously you want to get your compression down a bit, but don't lose sight of "Quench Dist" (should be .040-.060").

"Deck Milled" and "Bored Out" should be positive values reflecting material removed (negative values would reflect material being added).  "Piston Dish" is the volume of a dish (a negative value would indicate a domed piston).  Where applicable, change the "cc" values and the "ci" values will update.

I took my best guess as to what your setup is... generally speaking, the 'yellow' dimensions are what we can easily change for the build.  Green boxes are calculation results.

Good luck,
Evan

Look guys I really appreciate you guys help but I think I am just going send back the kit. Its a bad situation but I just think it would be best to cut my loses and move on. I really wanted to 512 kit anyway. I dont want to compromise when I know what I want.

[PlumCraZRT]

Look guys I really appreciate you guys help but I think I am just going send back the kit. Its a bad situation but I just think it would be best to cut my loses and move on. I really wanted to 512 kit anyway. I dont want to compromise when I know what I want.

Regardless of what you end up putting together, you should spend some time with that spreadsheet and make sure you are really getting what you want.  I spent a lot of time with that when I was putting my engine together and it paid off.  Lastly, I think this whole mess would have been avoided if you had a spreadsheet like that before you ordered.

[woody9512]

Sorry to hear about the issue with Hughes Engines. I was actually thinking about maybe getting some ported iron cylinder heads from them
I had thought that they were pretty well regarded when it comes to engine stuff??

[torqueaddict]

 

Sorry to hear about the issue with Hughes Engines. I was actually thinking about maybe getting some ported iron cylinder heads from them
I had thought that they were pretty well regarded when it comes to engine stuff??

It depends on who you ask. I am not pleased at all with the service I got for
 There. I wouldn't do it if I were you.