Author Topic: Hidden Collision Damage  (Read 7337 times)

Offline Surfmichaels

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Hidden Collision Damage
« on: April 04, 2013 - 10:33:53 PM »
When I bought my 73 barracuda all the panels lined up very nicely and the sheet metal i could see looked great. During disassembly I discovered that there was some damage to the front end. Any suggestions on how difficult the following would be to fix? No one that I've called in Los Angles  has been willing to even look at it except Kemper, I feel like a good frame machine should be able to get most of this out.  Im not going to try for oem gold or even bronze but i will be doing track events so predictable handling and safety are my concerns. Any suggestions are truly appreciated as if I need to replace metal I need to start budgeting now.  Thanks!




Offline jimynick

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2013 - 11:02:46 PM »
First, try to find the frame specs for this car. I think someone once put them in a thread here, so perhaps you can dig them out. Failing that, I'd look for a long time in business body shop because they used to publish a book every year with line drawings and the specs for all N.American cars. I remember using them. Once you've got the specs, find a decent shop with a good pulling/measuring system, a Chart, Chief, Wedge Clamp, Blackhawk etc. Pulling your car is no different than pulling a 2012 car and perhaps a bit easier as there's no HSS, boron or foam and any bodyman worth the name should be able to clamp and pull that rt rail over and to it's proper length. The beauty of the old cars is you can use heat without screwing the steel up and with judicious pulling and heating, most of the wrinkles in the rail should come a long ways towards coming out. To make it perfect, I'd drill out the spot welds and slice the outer skin off back behind the damages, dolly them nicely, or use the straightened piece as a template to cut a new rail side out of 18ga. steel and reweld the seam and button welds. Grind, seal and paint it. I don't know your local rates, but up here they run approx. $60 per hour and I'd estimate this as an all day job, so figure $500-600 ball park if the shop's being fair with you, plus let's say $75 for shop materials. Good luck  :2cents:

Offline brads70

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2013 - 12:30:30 PM »
I think this one is Cuda


Compare it to this Challenger one.


Found this one on my computer....
« Last Edit: April 06, 2013 - 08:58:14 AM by brads70 »
Brad
1970 Challenger 451stroker/4L60 auto OD
Barrie,Ontario,Canada
Proud to own one of the best cars ever made!!!!!

My restoration thread 
http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=59072.0
 My handling upgrade post
http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=73985.0

Offline Surfmichaels

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Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2013 - 07:06:45 PM »
Great thoughts, thank you both. Since i got a great deal on the car that cost isn't too much to bear. Luckily I did buy the full shop manual on cd although it takes me forever to find anything in it. I thought living in SoCal would mean a lot more resources and shops willing to work on classic cars but all the local guys only want insurance work. I'll think Kempers Muscle garage is going to get a shot at this one. Is this how alot of full restorations start? You think your fixing just the problems and then you realize that means the entire car! I had always wanted to buy a kit car and build it myself, turns out I did one better and bought a car that had to be both taken apart and then rebuilt...    Thanks

Offline CUDA JAS

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2013 - 10:33:27 PM »
good advice here.

Hey Brad, can you email me a copy of the specs for the cuda...probably pretty handy.

I tried saving it and increasing the size but can't seem to get it to work.

Jason
74 'cuda 360/727



Gearhead: car nut, automotive enthusiast, one who loves hot rods, muscle cars, hot trucks, burnin' rubber and neck snapping performance. 

Just call me a gearhead!

Offline 73restomod

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2013 - 01:21:51 AM »
Also, even a strait car can have wonky measurements. Just depends how "on" the guy jigging the car was that day.

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Offline torredcuda

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2013 - 06:37:07 AM »
Any body shop with a frame machine can easily fix that.It`s odd that the shops don`t want the job as you`ll pay them the same rate and pay as soon as the job is done.  :clueless:
Jeff
72 Barracuda 340/4spd  Torred
70 roadrunner 383/auto  In-Violet
70 Duster 360/auto drag car  (Petty Blue soon)
04 Ram 2500 5.7 Hemi

Offline brads70

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2013 - 06:45:04 AM »
good advice here.

Hey Brad, can you email me a copy of the specs for the cuda...probably pretty handy.

I tried saving it and increasing the size but can't seem to get it to work.

Jason

Send me an e-mail? Somehow I lost your address?
Brad
1970 Challenger 451stroker/4L60 auto OD
Barrie,Ontario,Canada
Proud to own one of the best cars ever made!!!!!

My restoration thread 
http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=59072.0
 My handling upgrade post
http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=73985.0

Offline CUDA JAS

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2013 - 07:45:12 AM »
Send me an e-mail? Somehow I lost your address?


Done.  Thanks.

Now back to your regularly scheduled post!

Jason
74 'cuda 360/727



Gearhead: car nut, automotive enthusiast, one who loves hot rods, muscle cars, hot trucks, burnin' rubber and neck snapping performance. 

Just call me a gearhead!

Offline Surfmichaels

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Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2013 - 09:41:27 AM »
Also, even a strait car can have wonky measurements. Just depends how "on" the guy jigging the car was that day.

I think my car was on the line at the end of a happy hour lunch. The rear seat cross brace was never welded properly just a giant blob of molten metal covered with factory paint, and there is extra welding wire all over the car, I've clipped off near 5ft hanging under the carpet and panels. I wonder what the worse "factory" installed mistake has been..

Offline getslideways

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2013 - 06:33:20 PM »
I wonder what the worse "factory" installed mistake has been..

slant-6

I kid I kid  :bigsmile:

Offline Surfmichaels

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Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2013 - 06:17:17 PM »
Called 6 local shops today, none of them would even quote me because the cuda wasn't in their database, one did say he'd look at it for only 300$ oh joy. For what looks like a fairly straight forward repair they seem scared of the car. I was hoping to avoid an extra 30 mile tow as its pretty pricy out here. Guess body work isn't what it used to be....   :)   

Offline jimynick

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2013 - 11:05:08 PM »
Sorry to hear the local yokels  are trying to jam you up! As mentioned, I don't get it, you've got the specs and it's not a difficult hook up. A P4 setup on the rocker pinch welds is all they need. Sad commentary on today's bodymen that they can't even read the specs and need the computer to do their thinking for them.  As for build quality, if it'll make you feel better, when I cut out the trunk floor on my Challenger, we noted that the rt trunk floor extension was installed exactly 3/4" lower than the main floor panel and there were half moon spot welds where the welder couldn't get in for a whole weld. I took photos of it because sooner or later, there'll be someone who says that stuff never happened- yeah, right. Good luck with the repair- I'd look for an older guy who's not afraid of the car; they're out there.  :thumbsup:

Offline Surfmichaels

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Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2013 - 11:33:29 PM »
Thanks for the encouragement, and insight. I've been lucky growing up with a dad who was a mopar mechanic, he had 3 cudas (70 vert,71 and 74) and dart gts so I always thought mopars where what a car should be. If its not a camero or mustang people lose their.

 I'll bring it to the localish speciality mopar shop (who also said they've never fixed frame damage) but its really sad that true craftsmen aren't as easy to find.

Offline jimynick

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Re: Hidden Collision Damage
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2013 - 11:37:58 PM »
Good luck, but be careful, especially with people who tell you up front that they've never fixed a frame, or sub-frame in this case. Sounds like your Dad's experienced, ask him who he knows from the old days. Maybe the guy or his son, is still around. Experience is a good thing here, so strive to find it. Just my  :2cents: