Your thoughts on originality?

Author Topic: Your thoughts on originality?  (Read 2805 times)

Offline OzCuda

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Your thoughts on originality?
« on: April 12, 2005 - 11:00:23 PM »
I’m interested in the various points of view regards restoration and originality and whether it makes much difference if the car is a bit on the basic side.  The Barracuda is a 318/904/7.25 slapstick with white interior and originally limelight and generally pretty basic with standard bonnet etc.  Car is a one owner California car, supposedly numbers matching (not so sure anymore) and I was looking to keep it ‘reasonably’ original while dressing it up with factory optionable gear.  Now the tease – I’ve been offered a 383/727 out of a 67 Charger which with the 8.75 diff I already have would make for a very sweet little car.   My thoughts are that an absolutely original car is desireable and if it is a numbers matching big block etc, then it is worth real money.  But is a standard 318 a better investment of time/effort than what will effectively be a ‘Cuda clone.  Ultimately I know it is a case of whatever makes me happiest but is it more a case of 1 out of 10 people ‘appreciate’ a true restoration but 9 out of 10 prefer the dream car, clone or not?

My other question is whether a 318 in a 70 Barracuda will actually have a number stamped on it that matches the VIN?  I have received conflicting reports on whether this is the case.  Does numbers matching just mean having the correct casting codes for the date of manufacture if a VIN number doesn’t exist?  Having trouble finding the number anyway with manifold/cross-member/grease in the way (lower right-hand side of the block?) so may not be able to resolve this until engine comes out of the car.  Cheers, Mark.
'70 Barracuda




Offline Carlwalski

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2005 - 11:33:27 PM »
If I were you I'd work that bad boy up, paint it a High impact color or what ever you like, buy it a bulge hood.
The drivetrain you have isn't the greatest of power makers and to be fair wouldn't fetch much if restored to original spec, well not in the near future anyway. I would take that 383 or wait until a 440 pops up and make one hell of a clone, an AAR would be VERY possible and those cars done properly fetch good money ($20-$35,000 US). At the end of the day it's your choice and like always the only thing stopping us in our restos/cars is money $$$, if you don't have that your going no where.  ;) :grinno:

As for numbers matching you will have the last 6 or so digits of your VIN stamped on certain areas of your car.
Engine, Trans, Cowl, Radiator support, Door tag sticker and Dash.
If they all match up you have a numbers car (basically) I say basically because there are guys out there who do rat cars off although Illegal it happens, very rarely though.  :) A numbers car can be sometimes a bad thing, we had a guy on here who wanted to sell his numbers 340 Cuda for a clone just because you can cut corners if needs be and you  can drive it without worrying as much.

Hope this helps mate.  :thumbs:
1970 Dodge Challenger R/T
White, License Plate, 0A-5599
540ci Aluminium Hemi, F.A.S.T EFI
TF-727 Gear Vendor OD, Dana 60

Offline Street_Challenged73

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2005 - 11:35:09 PM »
Oz, I'd say if it's big block power you want, go for it!!!  I mean you can always keep what appears to be the original engine on an engine stand in the back corner of your garage.  I had a similar choice to make about my Challenger.  It too was an original 318/904 combo in a color I didn't care for, so I plan on keeping all the numbers-matching components stashed away while I install a date-coded 340 engine along with a 727 transmission.  As for paint, I know that can always be changed, so I chose Plum Crazy with either a white interior and white top or a black interior with a white top. (again, the decision to keep a vinyl top on it is because it came from the factory with one, so I figure I'll keep that part of it correct too, even though it'll be a different color.)  Keep us posted with what you decide and best of luck with your decision.
1973 Dodge Challenger......................The ongoing project. (00/----\00)
1991 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo....The sunny day cruiser (RTBoost)
1990 Toyota Celica GT Liftback...........The new daily & winter driver.
All-American Muscle: 'Cudas and Challengers...Still the Elite and always will be.

                                                                                             
                 
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Offline Carlwalski

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2005 - 11:38:39 PM »
..white top or a black interior with a white top. (again, the decision to keep a vinyl top on it is because it came from the factory with one, so I figure I'll keep that part of it correct too, even though it'll be a different color.)  Keep us posted with what you decide and best of luck with your decision.

I bet you won't put it on at all.  :grinno: I was saying the same thing you were and at the last minute, NO! Leave it off. Glad I did to.  :grinyes:
1970 Dodge Challenger R/T
White, License Plate, 0A-5599
540ci Aluminium Hemi, F.A.S.T EFI
TF-727 Gear Vendor OD, Dana 60

Offline 67 Cuda

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2005 - 11:40:18 PM »
I would build it up.  I'm all for originality, I usually prefer that.  9 out of 10 times I say keep the car stock, but in your case I think you should go ahead and build her up.

Offline Ghost

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2005 - 12:56:07 AM »
It's a 318 car, man.  So, value is out of the "keep her original" arguement.  I say, she's your car, do what you want with her.

Offline Killer_Mopar

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2005 - 01:30:39 AM »
I'll say the same thing that I say everytime....Its your car, do what YOU want to it. If you build the car as a concours car just so that its "original", then you wont enjoy it as much as if you built it the way you want. My car is an original 383 R/T SE and when im done, its going to be nowhere near stock and I know I will enjoy the car far more than if I restored it to factory form. The only time I would restore a car to 100% factory form is if its a Hemi, 6-pak, or an oddity....and in all those cases, I wouldnt even want the car because I would be worried about it getting hurt.
70 Challenger R/T SE - The never-ending project........

Offline Steve

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2005 - 04:48:24 AM »
This is one of the cases where dropping in a different (and more desirable) drivetrain might actually bump up the value of the car! The way things in the market have been going, it seems that people are clammering just to get one of these cars in good shape, regardless of engine. Now, if you did something silly, like drop in a Chevy small block, you would have a problem.

I have only one suggestion for your 383: stroker!

Offline OzCuda

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2005 - 06:39:00 AM »
Thanks guys - starting to firm on the 383 plan, was told today I could have the engine, just have to crunch the numbers.  Anyone got an answer on the 318 number question?
'70 Barracuda

Offline BB73Challenger

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2005 - 07:19:38 AM »
The VIN will hold the following info:
model - price catagory - body type - engine code - last digit of the year - assembly plant - and finaly the seq. number.

The engine code will let you know what engine it came with as follows

JH23H3BXXXXXX

The H represents a 340 engine code, but does not give any other info. You will need to match it to I THINK the fender badge and maybe a sticker/badge on the drivers door. I could be wrong, but I'm sure the VIN alone can't "decode" it.
Jeff from Cleveland, Ohio

Offline BB73Challenger

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2005 - 07:22:29 AM »
Oh - and I agree, it's you car and have some fun. But it don't hurt to take that 318 and store it away. Makes a good selling feature if it should ever arrise.

Good luck and give us some pics!!
 :worthless:
Jeff from Cleveland, Ohio

Offline Pistol Gripper

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2005 - 07:35:25 AM »
My couple pennies worth:

Put in the big block, don't hork anything up so that the 318 can't go back in.  Put the 318 & all other removed parts in storage so that a numbers matching resto is still easy.  Then
 :burnout:

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Offline Old Moparz

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2005 - 10:39:53 AM »
Hot rod it with the biggest & least expensive motor you can get your paws on!
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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2005 - 10:58:14 AM »
There's always someone like me to go against the masses. Keep it original IF the block is original to the car. With the price of gas skyrocketing and the fact that the 383 swap has been done a thousand times, stick with easy on, easy off dress up goodies.

Offline Street_Challenged73

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Re: Your thoughts on originality?
« Reply #14 on: April 13, 2005 - 11:05:47 AM »

My other question is whether a 318 in a 70 Barracuda will actually have a number stamped on it that matches the VIN?  I have received conflicting reports on whether this is the case.  Does numbers matching just mean having the correct casting codes for the date of manufacture if a VIN number doesn’t exist?  Having trouble finding the number anyway with manifold/cross-member/grease in the way (lower right-hand side of the block?) so may not be able to resolve this until engine comes out of the car.  Cheers, Mark.


Oz, you'll find a raised 'block' on the lower passenger side of the engine.  It'll have what year the engine is, what plant it came from, and the sequence number. (All the same information you will find on the last 8 digits of your car's VIN.

Here's the VIN on my 340 block and my original trans. identification number, too.
1973 Dodge Challenger......................The ongoing project. (00/----\00)
1991 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo....The sunny day cruiser (RTBoost)
1990 Toyota Celica GT Liftback...........The new daily & winter driver.
All-American Muscle: 'Cudas and Challengers...Still the Elite and always will be.

                                                                                             
                 
Street_Challenged73 from Wisconsin